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Excalibur: ISA or EA ship?

M

Mondo Londo

Regular
Forgive me if we've already discussed this...

IIRC, Excalibur and its sister ship were built for the Interstellar Alliance. Why, then, is the crew almost enirely human and members of Earth Force?

And again, if this is an ISA ship, why do Earth Force and Earth Gov personnel give orders to Gideon?

Sheridan isn't exactly Mr. Popularity with the powers of Earth, so where does this very tight cooperation come from?

Push comes to shove, who claims final authority for the Excalibur, Gideon, and crew?


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"What's up, Drakh?"

Michael Garibaldi
 
It's called an "Earth Alliance destroyer" during the opening credits.

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4
 
From what I can recall of "A Call To Arms," Excalibur and her sister ship were built to begin to replace the Whitestars in the IA fleet.

Sheridan, being human himself and having somewhat of an investment in the survival of Earth, loaned the Excalibur to the EA to find a cure for the Drakh Plague.

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channe@[url="http://cryoterrace.tripod.com"]cryoterrace[/url] | "I wonder," said Frodo, "but I don't know. And that's the way of a real tale."
 
Actually, channe, I don't think they were intended to replace the whitestars. They are a new class of ship, sort of a whitestar destroyer (er, that is, a destroyer class ship that's like a whitestar, not something that destroys whitestars. Damn, I guess that's why you're the writer, not me.
smile.gif
)

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"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
 
The crew is entirely Earth Force.
The fighters, shuttles and other support craft are Earth Force.
It was built at an Earth Force shipyard.
But it uses Minbari(and probably Vorlon) technology.

It was never really explained. But it was part of the ISA program of sharing technology. It's strange, but all EA ships are probably using Minbari (or even Vorlon) technology by the time of "Rangers."


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4
 
Yes, the ISA made the ship to be used as the Destroyer class of their fleet. And as you all have said, It was loned to Earth to find a cure. But in the opening theme, Gidion says "...attached to the Earth Aliance Ship Excalibur..." So, somewhere someone screwed up!

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-With every light is born a shadow-
 
I don't think anyone screwed up
smile.gif


The ship has been loaned to the Earth Alliance and so while on loan, it becomes the "Earth Alliance Star Ship, Excalibur"

And Earth is paying the bills. Remember Mr Welles saying that the people back home are paying for this 'little Hail Mary among the stars"

ISA own the ship, EA are borrowing it and paying the bills for crew and maintenance
smile.gif


The inconsistency may come in ENIDOH where the Senator says he voted for the funding for the ship. Gideon contradicts him. But if the ISA built it in secret, as shown in ACTA, how did an Earth Senator get a vote?

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Demon

[This message has been edited by Demon (edited January 11, 2002).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mondo Londo:
Forgive me if we've already discussed this...

IIRC, Excalibur and its sister ship were built for the Interstellar Alliance. Why, then, is the crew almost enirely human and members of Earth Force?

And again, if this is an ISA ship, why do Earth Force and Earth Gov personnel give orders to Gideon?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It's an ISA ship that's on loan to EA. The ship is ISA. The crew is EA.

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KoshN
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Vorlon Empire

"To Live and Die in Starlight"
pilot movie for "Babylon 5 - The Legend of the Rangers"
January 19, 2002 at 9PM & 11PM EST, January 20, 2002 at 5PM on The Sci-Fi Channel (US).
http://www.scifi.com/b5rangers/
 
Possibly Earth paid for the modifications.

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Andrew Swallow
 
Weren't the Excalibur and the Victory the result of that agreement of the new class of ships that Sheridan & Delenn did in late season 5 - i.e. that Earth Alliance provides the money and Minbar provides the technical know-how?

So even if they were ISA ships, then they'd still be built with Earth money, so it made sense to loan it to EA (as well as Earth being in dire need and the Excalibur being the best ship ISA had for that job).

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"Isn't the universe an amazing place? I wouldn't live anywhere else." - G'Kar, B5: Rangers
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Weren't the Excalibur and the Victory the result of that agreement of the new class of ships that Sheridan & Delenn did in late season 5 - i.e. that Earth Alliance provides the money and Minbar provides the technical know-how? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And that would explain the Senator's comment in ENIDOH, and how he didn't vote for the funding. Thanks Kribu!

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Demon
 
Hey ... remember when there was just *THE* Whitestar ... the first and only? Then they built others, right? Well, I bet that during Crusade you would have seen more of these ships produced ... after all, it took 5 years to build 2 from scratch ... it would probably take less than 5 years to crank out some more when the plans were in hand.

Well, Excalibur and Victory were the first two ships of the new class of destroyers being built by the ISA to supplement the Whitestar fleet (bigger guns for taking on bigger enemies). As mentioned, the Exaclibur was made into a loaner for EA to look for the cure.

I bet you that by the end of Crusade we would have seen more ISA destroyers similar to the Excalibur. There probably would have been at least one nice big battle scene with a number of these ships versus either a Drakh fleet or some EA hybrid ships.

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The views expressed in this posting do not reflect in a mirror.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> I bet you that by the end of Crusade we would have seen more ISA destroyers similar to the Excalibur. There probably would have been at least one nice big battle scene with a number of these ships versus either a Drakh fleet or some EA hybrid ships. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't think it's that simple. The Drakh, on their way out, destroyed the shipyards the Victory class ships were made at.

Essentially, they'd have to start from scratch. Although maybe not totally, there are probably other things not held at the shipyard that they could get their hands on.

Another way would be to try to reverse engineer using the Excalibur. And that would mean it would have to be docked somewhere, not searching for a cure.

So, it's not going to be an easy task for the people who made the Victory class to reconstruct it, if it all. It may take some time, if they decide to persue that road at all.

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Sheridan: Are you trying to cheer me up?
Ivanova: No sir, wouldn't dream of it.
Sheridan: Good, I hate being cheered up. It's depressing.
Ivanova: So in that case we're all going to die horrible, painful, lingering deaths.
Sheridan: Thank you, I feel so much better now.
 
Well, it wasn't an Earth Alliance shipyard. It was an Edgars Industries shipyard under contract to the ISA.
That's why Garibaldi was the one giving orders to the chief engineer.
And why he was making progress reports to Sheridan.

Also, just because the Drakh destroyed the shipyard, that doesn't mean all the Documentation was destroyed.
Even today, we know the value of off-site data backups.
Garibaldi, being the slightly paranoid, obsessive compulsive person we've all learned to know and fear, would have had his own set of complete documentation.

The Shipyard needs to be rebuilt, then they can start building more ships.
Most likely, the Minbari would also be converting a couple of the shipyards that built the Whitestar fleet to build Victory Class ships.
That would get them rolling off the assembly line even sooner.

The aftermath of the attack on Earth would have Every Member of the alliance building ships as fast as they could, just in case they were next.

That would be in Addition to whatever new construction was going on because of the new technology the Minbari were sharing with everyone who joined the Alliance.



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Do not ascribe your own motivations to others:
At best, it will break your heart.
At worst, it will get you dead."
 
If I remember correctly, Sheridan said that it took years just to build the ships. And if the shipyards were destroyed, that means they have to build the shipyards before they build the ships, which is going to add on even more time. So there you are.
smile.gif


Rommie

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Keeper of Rommie's Quarters
Commanding Officer of Zeta Squadron
Sworn to Protect the GODDESS
Recipient of the Golden Rommie
"You've just started a war. One you're going to lose." Rommie - All Too Human
 
They also have more urgent needs than building new warships at the moment. The funds for building more Victory class warships may have been diverted with Sheridan's approbal.

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"Crying isn't gonna get your dog back. Unless your tears smell like dog food. So you can sit here eating can after can of dog food until your tears smell like dog food or you can go out there and find your dog."-Homer in The Canine Mutiny
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Doctor Gonzo:
They also have more urgent needs than building new warships at the moment. The funds for building more Victory class warships may have been diverted with Sheridan's approbal.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sheridan is embezzleing money from the alliance.



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4
 
the Excalibur and Victory are ISA ships on load to the E.A. to find a cure for the plague thats it- simple as that-

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Here is some spoo for thought.

Watch Call To Arms again. Particulary the part where President Sheridan states that the I.S.A. shipyards were wiped out by the Drahk on their way out. Now when he says this really pay attention to Sheridan's body language and his verbal inflections.

Yes the publically known shipyards were destroyed, but the I.S.A. knew better than to put all their eggs in one major basket. With Sheridan's interests in WWII history and Garibaldi's paranoia I suspect the I.S.A. had some other more secret shipyards hidden away (possibly in hyperspace). The I.S.A. already does not trust Earth Gov and so it wants Earth Gov's Bio Weapon, Advanced Technologies Depts., and I.X.P. off guard thinking that the poor I.S.A. has to start all over. Meanwhile Earth Gov. or the others mentioned above can work on furthering Shadow based technology (per the last 2 unproduced Crusade scripts To The Ends Of The Earth and The End Of The Line).

In conclusion at some point in the 5 year storyline of Crusade the I.S.A. would have sprung a timely surprise on naughty Earth Gov. by revealing a great many Victory Class destroyers (Excalibur type starships).

Damn TNT...sigh. Maybe when Rangers enters its 3rd season the Crusade storyline will continue (albeit from Martel and gang's perspective).

Speaking of the I.S.A. spacefleet just how does that starship Valen fit in? The White Stars could be classified as either a courier, gunship, or a multipurpose corvette. The Excalibur and her kind are destroyers. The Valen according to advertisements is the heavy flag ship of the I.S.A. Sounds like the Valen is a heavy cruiser.

Agree? Disagree?

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