Babylon 5 Books

[AnlaShokGrey]

You're not really making much sense. If people who are sf fans aren't on the internet, don't go to cons, don't read sf magazines, and don't talk to other sf fans, then how are they finding out about any new book releases in sf?? How do you find out about books (not necessarily tie-in books) you might be interested in reading? Do you have any idea what it costs to advertise in Time magazine, or on ABC-television during primetime, or any other 'wide net' ad campaign you might be envisioning? And, for the record: I don't read Time. Or Newsweek. Or Entertainment Weekly. Or any other magazine except for The New Yorker, Scientific American, and Consumer Reports. So Time magazine would most certainly not manage to 'net' all of the B5 fans who aren't hearing about it elsewhere.

Unless you're a huge company with piles of money to spend on marketing -- think AT&T, Apple, Target, Cingular, Ford, Sprint, etc. etc. -- you cannot cast a wide net. That's why advertising generally targets markets. And as Jan has pointed out, Del Rey made the best use of their advertising budget by doing what they did, targeting the market. As for how many people at Dragon*Con are B5 fans, the answer is: a lot. Every B5 event routinely overfills the largest ballroom at the con hotel, which is large. People come home from the con and blog, and post news (like at filmforce, aicn.com, etc.), talk to their friends, mention it to the guy at the comics shop, write articles for their local newspapers, etc. etc. And that's how the word spreads, and how other sf fans learn the news about their favorite franchise. If they're holed up in their house doing nothing but going to work, shopping for food, and reading "Time" magazine, they're going to miss a whole lot more than just the release of the B5 novels.

 

[Jan]

Exactly. If somebody doesn't know that the books even exist, how are they going to buy them?

Go into a bookstore and browse? Set up an alert with Amazon? It keeps sounding like you think that the trilogies would have become bestsellers if they'd been advertised the way you want them and that's simply not the case. They're not Harry Potter and they aren't even Star Trek. Heck, from what I've heard/seen, Trek books are the SF equivalent of Harlequin romances. People just keep churning them out and they keep getting bought regardles of quality or continuity. Few B5 fans would ever stand for that. And for those who want more B5 regardless, there's always Mongoose.

Jan

 

[KoshN]

You're not really making much sense. If people who are sf fans aren't on the internet, don't go to cons, don't read sf magazines, and don't talk to other sf fans, then how are they finding out about any new book releases in sf??

Chances are that they're not. Lots of people watch TV, but it ends there. It seems that very few read anything beyond the local newspaper. However, if they knew about canon novels in the universe of a favorite TV show, one they haven't had anything new out of in a long, long time, that could get them to read the novels. B5 got me back into reading novels. I was completely out of practice. I hadn't read for pleasure in 25 years. Now, I've read all of the B5 novels (some more than once), novelizations and short stories, and am branching out in other SF, and horror.

How do you find out about books (not necessarily tie-in books) you might be interested in reading?

Emails that I get from Borders (Borders Shortlist, where my areas of interest are New & Noteworthy Books, Audiobooks, Mystery/Thriller, Science Fiction & Fantasy, & DVD; and Borders Monthly) and Amazon.com, searches that I do on Amazon that turn up other links, browsing in bookstores, etc.

Note: Audiobooks are mainly just a curiosity to me, because I hate abridgements.

Do you have any idea what it costs to advertise in Time magazine,

No.

...or on ABC-television during primetime, or any other 'wide net' ad campaign you might be envisioning?

I said "a 15 second TV commercial on The Sci-Fi Channel," because it probably costs a lot less to advertise on than one of the broadcast networks. Even though it's only a niche channel, some TV advertising is better than no TV advertising, and people catch it in channel surfing.

And, for the record: I don't read Time. Or Newsweek. Or Entertainment Weekly. Or any other magazine except for The New Yorker, Scientific American, and Consumer Reports. So Time magazine would most certainly not manage to 'net' all of the B5 fans who aren't hearing about it elsewhere.

An ad. in Time, The New York Times, or TV Guide, is likely to reach a good cross section of the population, and that would likely include people who have seen B5 but would not have become aware of the trilogies any other way. For a TV ad., we'd have to make do with an ad. on The Sci-Fi Channel. Del Rey could never afford CBS, NBC or ABC, or even FOX or The CW.

Unless you're a huge company with piles of money to spend on marketing -- think AT&T, Apple, Target, Cingular, Ford, Sprint, etc. etc. -- you cannot cast a wide net. That's why advertising generally targets markets.

I'm not talking about year round ads. on CBS in primetime or in print in any of the publications we've mentioned. I am talking about ads. in places of general interest right before the books of the trilogies were about to hit the streets.

And as Jan has pointed out, Del Rey made the best use of their advertising budget by doing what they did, targeting the market.

What did Del Rey actually do at SDCC and DragonCon?

As for how many people at Dragon*Con are B5 fans, the answer is: a lot. Every B5 event routinely overfills the largest ballroom at the con hotel, which is large. People come home from the con and blog, and post news (like at filmforce, aicn.com, etc.), talk to their friends, mention it to the guy at the comics shop,...

Grassroots is great, but a single TV ad. on The Sci-Fi Channel could create a lot more buzz, and a buzz that more readily crosses over into the SF audience and the general audience.

...write articles for their local newspapers, etc. etc.

I've yet to see one, and I read the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette almost every day.

And that's how the word spreads, and how other sf fans learn the news about their favorite franchise. If they're holed up in their house doing nothing but going to work, shopping for food, and reading "Time" magazine, they're going to miss a whole lot more than just the release of the B5 novels.

Don't forget "watching TV."

 

[Sindatur]

I do have to say that perhaps it would've been a good idea to spend a little advertising on SciFi Channel, or cross promoting on WB DVDs (or VHS). I personally, only ran across the first 9 by chance (And only ended up getting 7 of them), when I was looking for something else at teh bookstore, and once I knew they existed, I followed up on it.

 

[crazyhorse]

Hardcore B5 fans would not like discontinuality but a lot of people couldn't care less.The sort of fans on dedicated internet fansites tend to be a little more hardcore

A mention of the books on the video releases wouldn't have cost much but probably would of reached as many people as all the conventions.A few posters for bookshops would of helped but even that was missing.If they were stocked in book shops in any quantity I would probably come across them.

BTW I've read and watched fantasy and sci-fi all my life and never been to a single convention and neither have any of my friends,most of whom have the same interests in fantasy/sci-fi.

In the UK B5 was a pretty mainstream show doing as well as Star Trek in popularity.The press loved the show and always gave rave reviews but there was little or no mention of any books.

I believe in the UK at least there was a market for these books if the public had a clue they existed.Bad marketing is my opinion of the matter at least in the UK.

 

[KoshN]

Go into a bookstore and browse?

Browse what, the books in spine-on display on the shelves? Do that for very long and you'll get a crick in your neck and get dizzy. All those titles tend to blend together and it's hard to find what you want.

Set up an alert with Amazon?

Well, that requires internet and email access. I was looking for ways to reach people who watch TV but aren't necessarily going to get the word through a PC.

It keeps sounding like you think that the trilogies would have become bestsellers if they'd been advertised the way you want them and that's simply not the case.

Bestsellers, no. Novels that would sell a lot better, reaching more existing B5 fans, yes. See, that's where a TV ad., even one only on The Sci-Fi Channel, can have some impact. It can create some excitement, and get people into the bookstores or on Amazon looking for the novels.

They're not Harry Potter and they aren't even Star Trek. Heck, from what I've heard/seen, Trek books are the SF equivalent of Harlequin romances.

Oh, I thought you meant "looked down upon" not "popular."

People just keep churning them out and they keep getting bought regardless of quality or continuity. Few B5 fans would ever stand for that. And for those who want more B5 regardless, there's always Mongoose.

 

[crazyhorse]

You're not really making much sense. If people who are sf fans aren't on the internet, don't go to cons, don't read sf magazines, and don't talk to other sf fans, then how are they finding out about any new book releases in sf??

Same way as people used to find out about new books before the internet.Through recomendations of friends and authors whose style you already enjoy,through advertisements in books you've already got and from the press and other promotions.Being a member of a decent book order club also helps as does popping in bookshops once or twice a month.

Waste of time asking other sci-fi fans if they don't know either.

Conventions are also a relatively new thing,well at least so many and so often.I know a lot of people that will never go to one but still watch and buy from the genre.You would also have to go to the right convention at the right time to see the promotion for the book.Wrong convention on the wrong date and you've missed it.

Never subscribed to magazines after White Dwarf was taken over by Games Workshop and turned into their pimping mag.I buy the occasional one and that is that.Most people are the same.

I did however know of The Gathering,watched it as it premiered and knew it was an introduction to a series that was going to be a five year arc and that never had full scale promotion.

 

[GaribaldisHair]

This whole notion of advertising B5 tie-in books on TV is just a non-starter from my point of view. This side of the pond, there is very VERY rarely any on-screen advertising of books, with the possible exception of expected HUUUUGE sellers, and much of that advertising is within adverts for the retailer rather than the book itself.

If you are going to criticise the way Del Rey marketed the B5 novels, then realistically you're criticising the whole marketing model of the book publishing industry. Perhaps that is valid, perhaps not ... as Amy used to work in the industry, I bow to her greater understanding of these things.

 

[AnlaShokGrey]

Browse what, the books in spine-on display on the shelves? Do that for very long and you'll get a crick in your neck and get dizzy. All those titles tend to blend together and it's hard to find what you want.

Er, that's exactly how I browse books in a bookstore. And in a library. And there are certain genres that I want to browse, because that's how you find what's newly published that you didn't otherwise know about.

Same way as people used to find out about new books before the internet.Through recomendations of friends and authors whose style you already enjoy,through advertisements in books you've already got and from the press and other promotions.Being a member of a decent book order club also helps as does popping in bookshops once or twice a month.

Waste of time asking other sci-fi fans if they don't know either.

Conventions are also a relatively new thing,well at least so many and so often.I know a lot of people that will never go to one but still watch and buy from the genre.

I never said that it was required that one go to conventions to hear about new books, or that that was the only way. It was one way I mentioned that people find out about books. And, you're contradicting yourself above: you say that people get recommendations from friends, then say that it's a waste of time asking other sci-fi fans if they don't know either. But if they're getting word-of-mouth recommendations from friends -- who may have gone to a con, or a bookstore, or whose friend, or whose friend's friend, may have -- it is indeed worth your time to ask them.

How does anyone here find out about the latest David Brin novel? How did any of you find out about the Spider Robinson treatment of the Heinlein outline? Etc. Someone is a prime source of information (a publisher), they get the word out in some conventional way (as Del Rey did), and someone reads or hears about it and passes the word along as humans always do. The internet, and conventions, are just modern improvements on talking over the back fence.

Just because you guys love this franchise, you can't expect Del Rey to go to insane lengths that no one in their right minds would go to for these books. Even a limited-duration ad on a major network costs a lot of money. Heck, even a limited-duration ad on SciFi during primetime costs a bundle! And books, like any other creative projects produced commercially, have budgets. And you can bet that a television ad on SciFi -- or a print ad in Time -- was most emphatically not in Del Rey's budget.

Amy

 

[crazyhorse]

Er, that's exactly how I browse books in a bookstore. And in a library. And there are certain genres that I want to browse, because that's how you find what's newly published that you didn't otherwise know about.



I never said that it was required that one go to conventions to hear about new books, or that that was the only way. It was one way I mentioned that people find out about books. And, you're contradicting yourself above: you say that people get recommendations from friends, then say that it's a waste of time asking other sci-fi fans if they don't know either. But if they're getting word-of-mouth recommendations from friends -- who may have gone to a con, or a bookstore, or whose friend, or whose friend's friend, may have -- it is indeed worth your time to ask them.

I don't know anybody who goes to sci-fi conventions or who buy sci-fi magazines.I know plenty of B5 fans who read though.Nobody knew about these books so asking these sci-fi fans wasn't an option.

I do find new books quite regulary even in Holland.I can always order books and I always get good recomendations from home.

All I am saying is that if I myself and probably twenty other B5 fans that I know read never even got a whiff of the fact that the books were released then the advertising must of been very low key.

I know there is a B5 roleplaying game even though I've never seen it.That would be even less mainstream than books but it got it's message out.I have no idea if it's any good or not or if it even sold but I do know it existed.I heard about the comics which is something that never really

Of course I'm a bit annoyed I never heard of them and therefore will probably never be able to read them as they appear to be a very important part of the overal story.

I'm not that bothered though

I am bound to find out about any new releases now though and because of that 5 or 6 copies will be sold

 

[KoshN]

This whole notion of advertising B5 tie-in books on TV is just a non-starter from my point of view.

Now, maybe, but when Babylon 5 or Crusade was being aired, either in first run or during repeat runs, commercials for the tie-in books might have been included during the commercial breaks during the episode, or at the end of the episode (to leave that thought in peoples minds at the end).

If you are going to criticise the way Del Rey marketed the B5 novels, then realistically you're criticising the whole marketing model of the book publishing industry.

Would it not make sense to try to have complimentary existing products (i.e. ones that compliment each other) help sell each other, and to look for partners in the makers of such products to lessen the cost of the ads. to Del Rey and spread the risk around a bit?

Perhaps that is valid, perhaps not ... as Amy used to work in the industry, I bow to her greater understanding of these things.

Just because that is the way things have always been done, doesn't mean that's the way it should always BE done. Based upon the way it's being talked about here, it seems that the whole marketing model of the book publishing industry is something that is chisled in stone and to be followed without question for the rest of time. Is nobody thinking outside the box, and looking for mutually beneficial alliances?

 

[KoshN]

Just because you guys love this franchise, you can't expect Del Rey to go to insane lengths that no one in their right minds would go to for these books. Even a limited-duration ad on a major network costs a lot of money. Heck, even a limited-duration ad on SciFi during primetime costs a bundle! And books, like any other creative projects produced commercially, have budgets. And you can bet that a television ad on SciFi -- or a print ad in Time -- was most emphatically not in Del Rey's budget.

And I suppose a poster for bookstore windows, say one for each trilogy, would break the bank? What size advertising budget are we talking about her, $100/trilogy?

I ask again, what did Del Rey do at SDCC and DragonCon? What did they present, any materials at all? Any handouts? A rep. standing up on a stage telling everybody in a room "Del Rey is coming out with three Babylon 5 trilogies and these are the titles. <states titles> Thank you for coming. Have a nice day." ??

 

[Jan]

I ask again, what did Del Rey do at SDCC and DragonCon? What did they present, any materials at all? Any handouts? [/i] ??

I wasn't at those cons then but I can guess pretty well. At virtually every con there are 'freebie tables' where anybody passing by can pick up flyers, coupons, games, toys, comics, posters, books...any number of things sometimes including shirts, caps and other give-aways. Contrary to what I'd have expected, these are *very* popular and the cons often make sure that each attendee has to pass by them several times. At WorldCon this past summer, several publishers scheduled give-aways samples of upcoming books.

As a for-instance, this past year at SDCC, WB and AOL gave away fans shaped like G'Kar's head with the info on getting the B5 episodes online. This was a great idea because when there are 114,000 (yes, I took that from their website) people in close quarters, it's going to get stuffy no matter how good the ventilation was. Those were the fans that JMS mentioned in one of the script books.

Jan

 

[KoshN]

I know there is a B5 roleplaying game even though I've never seen it. That would be even less mainstream than books but it got it's message out. I have no idea if it's any good or not or if it even sold but I do know it existed. I heard about the comics which is something that never really...

...got into? ...got a chance to read?

I've seen elements of the roleplaying game on the shelves at Barnes & Noble (box in face-on display behind the registers), and Amazon.com sends me alerts of anything "Babylon 5" produced, and that includes books and cardsets of the roleplaying game, and the Mongoose novels (neither of which I'm interested in).

Have you heard about the Mongoose novels (non-canon and non-endorsed by JMS) anywhere else, or only on the internet/newsgroups?

Of course I'm a bit annoyed I never heard of them and therefore will probably never be able to read them as they appear to be a very important part of the overal story.

I'm not that bothered though

I am bound to find out about any new releases now though and because of that 5 or 6 copies will be sold

What are you talking about here, the comics, the roleplaying game, the new Mongoose novels or "Babylon 5: The Lost Tales" DVDs? For B5 comics, check here:



http://www.intergalactictrading.com/

Under "B" -> "Babylon 5" -> "Books/Magazines" they have 57 items, including three of the comics.

See also:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylo...ories,_and_comic_books#The_Technomage_Trilogy

for a list of the comics.


The roleplaying game and the new Mongoose novels are decidedly NOT a very important part of the overal story. However, the "Babylon 5: The Lost Tales" DVDs will be.

 

[AnlaShokGrey]

And I suppose a poster for bookstore windows, say one for each trilogy, would break the bank? What size advertising budget are we talking about her, $100/trilogy?

Do you know for a fact that they didn't produce posters for bookstores? Bookstores get those one-sheets and small posters for gazillions of books and publishers and imprints, but they don't put them all up. They can't. And SF is the redheaded stepchild of book publishing, just as it's the redheaded stepchild of television. And Babylon 5 is not Trek. It's a show that had a small-to-medium sized following, and mainly among serious ("hard") sf fans. They don't generally need/care to advertise to people like us, and "Babylon 5" means very little to general bookstore-goers. Which all combines to mean that it's highly unlikely that even if bookstores did get Babylon 5 novel posters, they would have bothered to put them up.

It sounds like you're blaming Del Rey for something over which they had no control.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

OK, former employee of a small, independent bookstore, here to tell some of you that you're nuts.

You know what determines which books go spine out and which face out on a display in an indy bookstore? How many books I have to fill "x" feet of space in a given section and which covers look best. I may have been a little more selective in the new hardcover sections, but in paperbacks it was strictly a matter of making the shelves come out even. The book that went face out was the one I had a lot of copies of, because if I only had one copy the pressure from all the spine out books would make the gap collapse.

End cap displays and posters are moslty for new hardcovers that publisher expects to do well (books by perennial best selling authors, books with lots of "buzz", books tied in to films or hot news stories or any kind of controversy) and for the initial paperback release of books that were hardcover bestsellers a year ago. Nobody does this stuff for paperback originals except maybe Harlequin, the Star Wars books and the "event" Trek books like the series cross-overs for which they hire fairly decent writers. The usual Trek drek gets no more promotion than any other western, romance, war, SF, fantasy or mystery paperback original. None of those gets TV or mainstream magazine advertising, either, not even the ones tied into TV series. (Did you know there are Gilmore Girls books? Neither did I until I accidentally searched "Amazon.com" instead of "DVDs" one day. I'm a big fan, have all the DVD sets watch the show and never saw a single commercial or mention of the books.)

Because our store had limited floor space, we didn't put out all the displays and end-pieces we did get. (Thank God. I hated putting those stupid things together. ) My boss picked out which ones we'd go with, often based on which publisher's rep had ticked her off most the last time they'd met. The rest went into the recycle bin, unopened.

The fact is almost no books are advertised on TV, because there isn't enough of an overlap between book readers and TV viewers to make it worthwhile. (C-SPAN's BookTV probably sells more books than the rest of TV combined and hardly anyone watches it. ) C'mon, think about it? What books have you seen advertised on TV? The latest John Grisham or Stephen King or Sue Grafton? How many disposable paperback originals? (Because that's what these books are for most readers and all publishers. Something to read on the train or the plane or the bus and leave behind for the next person, as often as not.)

Now flip through Time magazine and tell me about all the book advertising you see. You know where publishers advertise? The New York Times Book Review. Because they want to reach book readers. They don't waste their time tryiing to "spread the net wider" by advertising books to people who don't read books in the hope that the ad will do what millions of books evidently haven't - get them interested in reading books. (Boy, that would have to be a really good ad. )

Similarly I don't see what is so stupid about trying to sell Babylon 5 books to people who are already interested in Babylon 5 - or at least SF in general - instead of trying to use an advertisement to create an interest in a book which is iteself a spin-off of a TV show that the target audience never watched and isn't interested in. Next time you have a couple of million dollars lying around, go ahead and give that a try. Let me know how it works out.

By thw way, I don't know where you got the "$100 per trilogy" figure for doing posters for the Dell books (well, I have my suspicions and all I can say is I hope you washed your hands) but 3 seconds rational thought should make you realize that $100 wouldn't cover the postage to send a set of four-color posters to a couple of dozen bookstores, much less the thousands of bookstores across the country - and the cost (artwork and design plus production) of the posters themselves.

Look, I don't go around telling farmers how they should rotate their crops, or telling my my nephew the sax player that he should hold that note just a little bit longer. I don't do this because I understand that I don't know f***-all about farming or playing the saxaphone and I'd probably make an ass of myself if I tried. Especially if I did so over and over again using the same tired, silly and discredited arguments. I'm not a real humble guy, but I have enough humility to recognize when I'm totally out of my depth on a subject. When I really need to just shut up and let it go because I'm not contributing anything worthwhile to the conversation and, in fact, wouldn't recognize a worthwhile contribution if it came up and bit me on the ass.

Regards,

Joe

 

[KoshN]

Do you know for a fact that they didn't produce posters for bookstores? Bookstores get those one-sheets and small posters for gazillions of books and publishers and imprints, but they don't put them all up. They can't.

08/22/2001

Del Rey:
We certainly make no secret of these releases--each one is fully spotlighted in the catalog we use to sell our novels into the book stores, and we announce each book via ads appearing in science fiction trade publications like Locus Magazine. We also announce each and every one via our internet newsletter and on our web site, posting sample chapters to attract new readers. And we spread the word via our staff and displays at the major summer conventions, including DragonCon, GenCon, and San Diego ComicCon, with a total attendance of more than 100,000 fans.

Hmmmm, no posters for bookstores mentioned.

08/24/2001

KoshN:
I really meant in displays in bookstores. Something that attracts attention. Usually even *I*, a B5 fan, don't have an easy time finding B5 books in bookstores (especially Barnes and Noble). See below (set off in asterisks) where I just explained to somebody else, what I usually find in bookstores:

**************************************
Were I not a B5 fan on the newsgroups (e.g. rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated), *I* would not know that the books were even out there. In bookstores, the B5 books are almost always in spine-on display (almost never in face-on) display, and NEVER, EVER in their own display, and are often categorized by Author (so they're scattered all over the place). In contrast, Star Trek books (even "Voyager" books) are often in face-on display, and are all together in one place.

Whenever I go in a bookstore, the first thing I do is to put the B5 books in face-on display, if possible (if any are in stock and if *I* can find 'em). Sometimes I even put the glut of Trek books (especially Voyager books) that are in face-on display, into spine-on display.

At my local Waldenbooks, they always get in 7 copies of the latest B5 book, and they're gone in 2 or 3 days, tops. Then, they get 1 more copy in, for the shelves. Right now, my local Waldenbooks has zero Psi Corps books, one copy of Centauri Prime book #3, and one copy of Technomage book #1 & #2. That's it! They have a whole display unit of Trek books.
**************************************

Del Rey:
And once the books reach the stores, it's completely up to the stores themselves to decide how they display the new releases. We can't dictate to them how they run their stores.

KoshN:
Can you offer cardboard, Point-of-Sale display units, something to attract attention, and make them easier to find? How about hanging paper signs? Anything to make them stand out.

Del Rey:
The situation with stores is simple--they choose what to do with the space, including display units and posters. Unless the demand for Babylon 5 skyrockets, they're more likely to use that valuable space for more high-profile releases. It's really up to them--as it should be, since they own the stores--and we wouldn't want to produce display materials that are going to end up on the floor of a storage closet.

Sound like they produced any display materials to you? No? Me, either.


A couple of days after Legions of Fire Book III hit the streets, and I was getting my copies (1 for me and 2 for friends), I asked if they'd gotten any ad. materials from the publisher and was told "No, but we could put one of the copies in the display in the front window." I said that'd be great, and they did it. That was at WaldenBooks in the Beaver Valley Mall in Monaca, PA.

And SF is the redheaded stepchild of book publishing, just as it's the redheaded stepchild of television. And Babylon 5 is not Trek. It's a show that had a small-to-medium sized following, and mainly among serious ("hard") sf fans. They don't generally need/care to advertise to people like us, and "Babylon 5" means very little to general bookstore-goers. Which all combines to mean that it's highly unlikely that even if bookstores did get Babylon 5 novel posters, they would have bothered to put them up.

It sounds like you're blaming Del Rey for something over which they had no control.

Nope. They chose to be mainly passive, to do as little as possible.

 

[Dyabolikal]

Hey guys, just wanted to let you know (I'm not trying to rub it in, I'm just excited) that I got Legions of Fire III in the mail today from my eBay seller. It looks smaller than I thought it would, but the cover art is awesome

I then proceeded to go online and order Legions of Fire I and II, and To Dream in the City of Sorrows and The Shadown Within. After watching all of B5 through about five times, I'm really psyched to delve into the unanswered parts of the arc.

Anyways, good luck again to those who are trying to find the aforementioned enigma of a novel; with perseverence and a little luck you will one day succeed.

 

[KoshN]

Hey guys, just wanted to let you know (I'm not trying to rub it in, I'm just excited) that I got Legions of Fire III in the mail today from my eBay seller. It looks smaller than I thought it would, but the cover art is awesome

I then proceeded to go online and order Legions of Fire I and II, and To Dream in the City of Sorrows and The Shadow Within. After watching all of B5 through about five times, I'm really psyched to delve into the unanswered parts of the arc.

So I guess you already have The Passing of the Techno-mages trilogy?

Anyways, good luck again to those who are trying to find the aforementioned enigma of a novel; with perseverence and a little luck you will one day succeed.

I managed to find one for the person way above who was looking for it. He just needs to read his PM.

 

[AnlaShokGrey]

Hmmmm, no posters for bookstores mentioned.

Sound like they produced any display materials to you? No? Me, either.

Hmmm, reading all of the information you got from the guy at Del Rey, and factoring in everything I've told you (and Jan and Joe have said as well), do you really think that those posters would have made any difference, especially since most bookstores would have left them in a pile in the back of the stockroom until they remembered to throw them out?

A couple of days after Legions of Fire Book III hit the streets, and I was getting my copies (1 for me and 2 for friends), I asked if they'd gotten any ad. materials from the publisher and was told "No, but we could put one of the copies in the display in the front window." I said that'd be great, and they did it. That was at WaldenBooks in the Beaver Valley Mall in Monaca, PA.

There are so many ways I could go with this. But I'll be nice, and play it straight: so how did that effect their sales of the book? And how much display space for posters (or any other promotional paper materials, for that matter) do you see at most major booksellers?

Nope. They chose to be mainly passive, to do as little as possible.

Or, "they" (whoever you are blaming for this) chose to not exceed their budget.

With the millions of books published every year, why would a publisher choose to defy all reason and convention and try to find a larger audience for a sub-class (tv tie-in) of a niche genre (sf) that has historically been limited to a fairly small segment of the population? I've got news for you: if you're not browsing the bookstores and libraries, if you're not reading publishing industry magazines or hotsheets, if you're not on mailing lists for bookstores and catalogs and newsletters and (in the old days) zines, if you're not talking to other fans/friends/people at your comics shop, you are not the typical sf reader.