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Vorchan, Whitestar, SunHawks


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I believe that these type of ships are superior tha their destroyer counter parts. They are more manuevarble, can be produced in greater numbers using equal resources, and can be crewed by fewer people.

In battles during the show, these ships manueverabilty has been their strong suite against the slower destroyer types.

Please discuss
Whitestar's gain advantages from their Minbari engines and vorlon derived hull and weapons. In this respect, they appear to be faster than Earth alliance destroyers, as an example, but still vulnerable to their weapons as we saw several times during the later half of s4.
Nethertheless, the technology in them is so advanced it is not really fair to lump them in the same category as the other two ships you mention.
Vorchans are undoubtedly fast, but always seemed to attack in superior numbers. Difficult to tell.
The only time i can recall seeing sunhawks in action is in season3ep1, and ep21, when they are destroyed easily.
I believe that these type of ships are superior tha their destroyer counter parts. They are more manuevarble, can be produced in greater numbers using equal resources, and can be crewed by fewer people.
Well I guess it depends for what purpose they're better, and also the relative age between them and their destroyer counterparts.

Though for the Whitestar class ships, you'd be looking at the Victory class destroyers (i.e. the Victory and the Excalibur) as a comparison.
For the resources and manpower it takes to build an Excaliber class ship, you can probably build 3 to four whitestars. Same for the size of the crew. 3 Whitestars can be in several places at once enforcing the peace, etc. And can become a small squadron if their is a battle. The excalibur, however, can only be one place at a time.

I believe 3 whitestars can defeat 1 excaliber.

Its the same with Vorchans vs Primus/Omega/Sharlin/G'quan
White Stars appear... a quite marginal comparison. They have inherent difference in technology. I would guess they were designed with little compromise.

They had no advantage to receive from fighters. Shadow vessels would simply not recognize conventional fighters.

White Stars too... were insufficient, and destroyed frequently... but once they did fire their main weapon, they had chances of hurting the Shadow vessel (which would have plain ignored fighters).


In a match of equal technologies, however... when a Victory-class destroyer launches its Earth-made fighters... (or worse, a Minbari or Centauri cruiser launches its better fighters)...

...a ship without fighter escort is deeply troubled. Sunhawks, frankly... appeared to be wiped floors with. Vorchans were seen engaging them with some success... like they also surprised civilian ships, and destroyed an unprepared Narn cruiser.

But to my recollection... they were not seen fighting a cloud of reasonably quick fighters, right as they begin to engage their carrier (of equal tonnage to their total tonnage).

It is, after all... a matter of packing most ability into least mass, while keeping flexibility. Which means... for different abilities... different sizes are best.
I'd agree with your assessment of their relative manueverablities, though when it comes to armament and armour it's heavily stacked in favour of the Victory class destroyer - for a start, it can fire in more than one direction simultaneously and it carries a fair number of Thunderbolts.

I guess the closest you'd get to a comparison would be the confrontation between the Advanced Omegas and Whitestars in 'Between the Darkness and the Light.' I think it's about four Omegas versus thirteen Whitestars, though Ivanova describes it as being heavily outnumbered.
Ivanova was outnumbered in her battle with the Shadomega. She said it and the fact that the only way slower ships can attempt to sorround faster ships is when there is more of them. Plus it says it on the DVD synopsis.

In the B5 universe there seems to be 2 types of space strategies. One is using huge destroyers with supporting fighters (EA, Narn, Minbari). The other is using medium class warships (Vorchan, Sunhawk, Whitestar, Drakkh "fighter"). My argument is of the inherent superiority of the latter. They can be built in greater numbers, pack quite a punch, relative to their size, and are more manueverable.

I beleive that fighters are mostly used againsts other fighters. There are a few instances that fighters take on and destroy huge warships, but they are still relegated into a supporting role. (they are used for attacks if there are no other options available). In the show we have seen Vorchans, Sunhawks, and Whitestars as the main element of an attack fleet.
Whitestar ships are lighter and faster. But in my opinion they lack of enough fire power. Remember how hard is for a whitestar to just "stop" a shadow vessel. And it can't destroy one by itself. I think the best human ship is the Victory-class vessel: the excalibur.
But the best ships are shadows. Better than vorlon...
Naw, I think the Vorlons can take the Shadows any day. Watch the Vorlon-Shadow battle in "Interludes and Examinations" again. The Vorlon transports -- as in the type of ship that Kosh has been riding around in up to that point -- can apparently knock out a Shadow ship with one blast, and we never see exactly how much damage the bigger Vorlon cruiser can do. Admittedly the Vorlons are probably using telepathy like crazy, and the Shadows probably weren't prepared for a fight with the Vorlons, and there may not have been any actual Shadows at the fight... but head to head, it seems the Vorlons pack more power. Moreover the big Vorlon cruiser shrugs off a Shadow ship's blast without trouble.

On the other hand... the Shadow ships, for all that they are bigger, seem to be more maneuverable, and they can phase in and out of hyperspace without using jumpgates. So perhaps while Vorlon ships are simply tougher, the Shadow vessels are more advanced overall.

Another explanation would be that the Shadows, knowing that by the terms of their agreement with the Vorlons that they wouldn't have to fight their rivals often, designed ships that could easily defeat younger-race ships but weren't intended to go toe-to-toe with other First Ones.
As for comparing Whitestars, Vorchans and Sunhawks, I would say that the Whitestars are the superior ones.
As for comparing Whitestars, Vorchans and Sunhawks, I would say that the Whitestars are the superior ones.

Not that you are biased or anything RW :p

Seriosuly though. When watching B5 we see what would be best described as squirmishes. With very few large battle scenes. As a whole sunhawks are inferior crafts but the majority of other vessels have their pro and cons. Each being useful for different purposes. For hit and run the whitestar is untouchable. Fire power and manouverability thats second to none. Including the shadows. In a major confrontation that hit and run tactic is largely negated by the size of a fleet. No numbers are ever given of exactly how many whitestars are lost in each confrontation. It appears even JMS is not above a little visual doctoring :LOL:
Seriously though, without the intervention of the Vorlons or shadows the other races were able to hold their own. Witht the advent of shadow tech and Vorlon tech, the scales became rapidly unbalanced.
Capital ships that bombed narn because the shadows had tacken out most of the narn fleet with weaponry they had no defense against.
I think it was all a case of picking your battles and Generals who never stood a chance in hell in the past and managed to win understood this.

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