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Bravo's 100 Greatest TV characters

Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

Dr. Smith is 97. Interesting choice for the top 100.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

Jamie Somers (at # 88) would count as science fiction by my definition of the phrase.


Since the basic premise of the show requires interstellar travel, you could easily list Dick Solomon as science fiction.


One could argue that Gil Grissom & Catherine Willow are science fiction. :devil: All of the stuff that they do certainly isn't real. ;) :confused: :eek: :devil:
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

Should have been on the list:

G'Kar & Londo Mollari
Lt. Cmdr. Data (ST:TNG)
John Cage (Ally McBeal)
Sam Beckett & Al Kalavichi (Quantum Leap)
George Francisco (Alien Nation)

...and if this had been made about 3 or 4 years ago, it should have included Dr. John Carter (ER), but not any more (besides, Doug Ross beat him out). Locke could be a conteder for a future version of the list if Lost continues to be as good as it is now. Christian Troy (Nip/Tuck), eh, maybe should have been just barely on the list or an honorable mention.

I may be able to think of more later.

It's kind of a messed up list anyway. It's unfair that Seinfeld, Friends, and Will & Grace get their casts lumped together. Individually, those characters wouldn't fair as well as they do, and at least one from each may have been off the list entirely.

If whole ensemble casts could be lumped together, why Buffy and Sam Malone individually instead of the whole Buffy and Cheers' casts, respectively? And, by those standards, the cast of Deep Space Nine should be on there, especially if the very frequent recurring characters from the last few seasons would count in that. In fact, why not the cast of Babylon 5? That ought to be #1.

Yeah, there should definitely be a separate list for character ensembles.

Anyway, glad to see--among others:
Charles Ingalls (Little House on the Prairie)
Benson (Benson)
Kermit (Muppets)
Eric Cartman (South Park)

Wait a second. My theory is blown. Andy Taylor and Barney Fife from Andy Griffith are listed separately, as are Frasier & Niles Crane. And, duh, Kirk and Spock are separate. So, John Cage & Ally McBeal could have been separate. Picard isn't necessarily beating out Data. And why are Sam & Diane from Cheers listed together--Diane sucked!!!

This is stressing me out. Screw it. I've got Christmas decorations to put up. :D
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

You know, all in all I really have no complaints about this list and think it was very well thought out, unique, and covered a BROAD RANGE of characters which IMO such a list should do.

My only complaint is that there were a few cop-outs (imo) where they would say "cast of seinfeld, cast of will and grace, cast of friends, etc." I guess its arguable in those shows (especially in Seinfeld's case) that all or most of those characters belong on the list. Ironically, I think Seinfeld himself doesnt belong on there, but Kramer for SURE, and probably George as well. But I still think having those sort of "cast of" things is a cop-out. Crockett & Tubbs when they were a duo in the show is ok though I guess.

You know whats odd, is that they grouped so many of those casts together...but Cheers of all shows they kept seperate. They listed Sam and Diane together, but had Carla, and Fraiser (Im sure because he also had his own show) seperately. So they had 4 Cheers members, but should have just listed the cast. That show is legend though...

I was really impressed with the following people that made the list.

Beaver (good call for that era and type of show)
Monk (newer show to be sure, but definately a unique character)
Alex P Keaton (who can argue there)
Jim Rockford and Maverick (go James Garner)
Barney Miller

And my personal favorite somewhat-obscure person to make it on the list who TOTALLY deserves it:

Doctor JOHNNY FEVER!

One that comes to mind that imo should have made it but didnt, Dan Fielding from Night Court.

But overall, great list, Im actually debating on watching the special. Maybe Ill TiVo it.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

I think that Londo and G'Kar are strong enough characters for such a list, but I would never expect to see them on one. A major component of "Great", as determined by these kinds of lists, is how many people among the polled group did those characters make an impact on. It does often become a matter of pure market penetration. Because of that, I don't expect any B5 characters on any such list (unless it is an "genre" specific list) any time soon.

Over the years I have also seen some great characters on shows that didn't last to the end of their first season. None of them garnered any consideration either, for the same reason.

This is also why these lists always tend to be somewhat biased toward the relatively recent. You had better have been on the air within the living memeory of a large percetage of the voters, in order to get their votes. If not, then your syndicated re-runs should be (and all the better if there was a more recent movie version of your show to remind people about you).

Off the top of my head, the closest things to characters that made the list without following those current market penetration guidelines are Sgt. Bilko and Maynard G. Crebbs. Even then, both have been on Nick-at-Night / TVLand a fair amount within the last decade and there was a recent Bilko movie (not that it was any good, but its existance did bring the name back to the surface). The next closest might be Ann Marie from "That Girl". That was on the air until the early 1970's, was played by someone who is still a public figure in her own right and is the daughter of an absolute show business legend.



It's unfair that Seinfeld, Friends, and Will & Grace get their casts lumped together. Individually, those characters wouldn't fair as well as they do, and at least one from each may have been off the list entirely.
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I would go further and say that, as well as they (and throw the Barone family in here too) play off of each other, if taken individually there are only 2 - 4 total among the four shows that I would even seriously consider for this list.



Benson (Benson)
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Maybe it's just a quirk of my exact age (at home in high school for the first couple seasons of "Soap"; at college without a TV for the first few prime seasons of "Benson"), but I *still* always think of Benson more as a character in "Soap" than as a central lead of his own series.

And just based on those couple years on "Soap", I like his presense in this list.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

And my personal favorite somewhat-obscure person to make it on the list who TOTALLY deserves it:

Doctor JOHNNY FEVER!
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Wouldn't you love to see him hang out with Rev. Jim Ignatowski? :LOL: :LOL:

Of course, to get the full effect you would have to have a "straight" person in the room with them.


They decided to stop at two from "Taxi" (Jim and Louie). I think that you could also seriously consider Latka Gravas.


(And it is too bad that the music rights issue means that we will probaly never see WKRP DVD's.)
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

I was pretty impressed with the list and how it covered just about all aspects of television. I must admit there are a few names I didn't recognize, but for the most part I know who most of them are, whether I watched the shows or not.

I too didn't like how they lumped some of the casts together. I was especially impressed with the top 20, although I don't think Cartman should have been in there. The only name I don't recognize is Carrie Bradshaw, but I will say that Archie Bunker sure deserved that top spot.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

Oh Frasier certainly deserves to be on the list. As a character on both Cheers and Frasier, each of which lasted like a dozen years, Frasier has been on TV for like 80 gazillion years.

My favorite TV character: Bill Clinton. A lot great character arcs, made me cheer, laugh, cry, grind my teeth, complex personality, and fascinating supporting cast.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

... covered a BROAD RANGE of characters which IMO such a list should do.
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Okay, I'll have to admit you're right; it does cover a broad range. I guess that's why it had to double up on characters when they go together in pairs but leave out multiples from shows when they don't pair up well.

You know whats odd, is that they grouped so many of those casts together...but Cheers of all shows they kept seperate. They listed Sam and Diane together, but had Carla, and Fraiser (Im sure because he also had his own show) seperately. So they had 4 Cheers members, but should have just listed the cast. That show is legend though...
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I didn't even notice Carla. Now, that's not right. Carla by herself is taking up a whole spot that could have been freed up by lumping that cast together. That would have been appropriate, especially since Norm & Cliff are just as good as (personally, I think better than) Carla. Woody wasn't bad either.

Ironically, I think Seinfeld himself doesnt belong on there, but Kramer for SURE, and probably George as well.
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I agree completely. In fact, I almost said that same thing in my first post. Seinfeld isn't really a character as much as he is an exaggerated version of the actor as a real person, and Elaine is really more of a female balance for the group. Kramer & George are neurotic enough to be unique on their own.

I don't like Will & Grace, so it's hard for me to be objective, but I'm guessing only Karen, and maybe Jack, could stand up on their own. From Friends, only Chandler because of his wit. Arguably, you could go for Joey & Phoebe because their quirks & challenged intellects are just extreme enough to make them unique. The other three are just filler in comparison.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

isn't really a character as much as he is an exaggerated version of the actor as a real person, and Elaine is really more of a female balance for the group. Kramer & George are neurotic enough to be unique on their own.

I don't like Will & Grace, so it's hard for me to be objective, but I'm guessing only Karen, and maybe Jack, could stand up on their own. From Friends, only Chandler because of his wit. Arguably, you could go for Joey & Phoebe because their quirks & challenged intellects are just extreme enough to make them unique. The other three are just filler in comparison.
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OK, I'll weigh in more specifically on the casts of "Seinfeld", "Friends", "Will and Grace", and "Everybody Loves Raymond".

Out of that cluster of 19 charactrers the ones that I would give consideration to for inclusion in this list as single characters are (in no particular order):

Kramer
George Costanza
Phoebe
Mother Barone (her first name escapes me at the moment)

As good as all of the other characters / actors are at what they do, those are the only four that I think are really unique enough to deserve a spot (and one could conceivably construct an argument against one or two of those four).



But, yes, I also think that overall they a better job with that list than is doen with the majority of these kinds of entertainment lists.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

The only name I don't recognize is Carrie Bradshaw
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Sarah Jessica Parker's lead character from "Sex and the City".
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Thanks! At least I know what the show is, and thanks to a former girlfriend I've seen two or three episodes, but it never interested me.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

Several of my favorites were on there, like Maynard G. Krebs, Perry Mason, Caine,Emma Peel. I'll have to admit that there were a lot I don't know. I'd say that to me the most glaring ommissions are Captain Kangaroo, Paladin, and Batman.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

Yes, yet another list. :)

By any chance are there any soap-opera characters on it? There should be. I remember when class attendances were down when I was in school because there was some wedding on General Hospital or something. :eek:
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

I don't recognize the vast majority of the names, but Buffy made 13, and that makes me happy.
 
Re: Barvo\'s 100 Greatest TV characters

By any chance are there any soap-opera characters on it?
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It depends on what all you count under the umbrella of "soap opera".

If you mean specifically daytime soaps, then no. They stuck to prime time television (with the possible exception of one or two shows that were syndicated and might have ended up anywhere on the schedule in any given market in the US. Emma Peel from The Avengers leaps to mind in this regard.)

If you mean "soap opera" in the broader sense, then there are characters such J.R. Ewing from "Dallas".


In terms of recognition:
I'm not sure that I could have come up with all of the names on my own. However, I don't think there were any in the entire 100 that I didn't recognize when I saw it. Is that a good thing because I have been at least peripherally exposed to all of the "classics" of American TV history? Is it a bad thing because it means that I have spent too much time watching pop culture pass by over the years? I'm not entirely sure. :cool:

Edit to add:
OK, I just scanned the whole list again specifically thinking about making sure that I really was attaching each name to a character.

There were two that I knew immediately when I got the name and and photo simultaneously when I was watching some of these shows last week, but I'm not entirely sure that I would have attached to the right face right away if I had *only* read the name without any other context. Those two were Eleanor Frutt (from "The Practice") and Ann Marie (Marlo Thomas' character from "That Girl").

There is also one on there for which I still need some context (not having seen that part of the show). That is "Artie" (without any last name or anything) at number 96.

I also think that if the full name was given for number 91 it would be clearer to more people. Instead of "Caine" it would be better if it listed "Quai Chang Caine", IMHO.
 
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