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The missing B5 links

D

drakh

Regular
I just read that the early versions of Ruling From the Tomb guest stared Garibaldi, but unfortunately he had to be cut because they couldn't afford to hire Jerry Doyle. It seems TNT wasn't the only one responsible for reducing the B5 presence on Crusade.

(Of course, Babylonian Productions relied on meticulous planning and high efficiency to make the budget go as far as it did. Having sudden production shutdowns, several new approval steps, and demands for changes coming in days before shooting starts wasn't helping.)

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You are not entitled to your own opinion. You are only entitled to your own informed opinion.
-- Harlan Ellison qouting Gustave Flaubert
 
"Value Judgements" would have had both Bester and Garibaldi, if it had been made. (It was next on the list, I think.)

btw, drakh, I've been meaning to say this for a while...I *love* the quote in your sig.
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Just a moment!...my muse is speaking to me...
 
According to a report on "Aint it Cool News" when in the series was still production, the character of Garibaldi was dropped from one (unnamed) episode for unspecified "budget reasons".

JMS later said (again, without mentioning a title) that a scene with Garibaldi in his office on Mars had been cut from one script, but not because the actor would have cost too much. The problem was the expense of the set itself. They wanted to make Garibaldi's "entrance" in Crusade a big deal, and give us a really impressive view of the Edgars-Garibaldi empire, but they just couldn't squeezed it into that script. ("AiCN" also mentioned blueprints for a Garibaldi office set having been created for the episode, which is one of the ways they verified the story that he had been scheduled to appear.)

I think the hope was that the scene and the set could be used in a later episode. The Garibaldi character would have made a cameo in "Value Judgments", but not necessarily the actor. We mostly hear one side of the conversation when another character speaks to Garibaldi. The only time Garibaldi is on-camera is written like one of Charlie's appearances in Charlie's Angels: we'd see him in shadow, from behind, and the only part of him that we'd see clearly would be his hand hanging up a phone. I don't think we ever hear him speak.

It was obviously written that way in order to get Garibaldi into the story without having to have Jerry Doyle in the episode, much the way JMS included Lennier in an early draft of "The Path of Sorrows". In both cases the characters are on-screen so briefly that wouldn't be worth the production's money or the actor's time to do the cameo.

It may be that the Garibaldi scene in "Value Judgments" was meant as a teaser for a more extensive appearance (complete with Mars office set) later in the first season.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net

[This message has been edited by Joseph DeMartino (edited October 16, 2001).]
 
Joe, I hate you. I was perfectly content with not caring about whether Crusade would get picked up again. Now I'm royally pissed that it didn't happen, with all the cool stuffing you and others keep writing about what would and could have happened.
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"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
 
Does Joe know all? I'm beggining to think he is omnipotent.
blush.gif


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"Forget about the reasons and
The treasons we are seeking
Forget about the notion that
Our emotions can be swept away
Forget about being guilty,
We are innocent instead
For soon we will all find our lives swept away"
-Dave Mathews Band
"Seek up"
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
JMS later said (again, without mentioning a title) that a scene with Garibaldi in his office on Mars had been cut from one script, but not because the actor would have cost too much.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Where was that? Compuserve? I can't remember ever reading it...



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You are not entitled to your own opinion. You are only entitled to your own informed opinion.
-- Harlan Ellison qouting Gustave Flaubert
 
Well if Rangers goes to a series I don't see why they can't use the same script, but just swap the main cast around. If it's mainly concerning Garibaldi then it should need only light editing. So if Rangers does go to series, I wanna see that ep damnit!
laugh.gif
Garibaldi was one of the best characters in B5 IMO.

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BETH: "Well all I did was go for a really long walk."
JIMMY: "Where'd you go?"
BETH: "I don't know... I mean... all over the city, I guess... and then somehow I ended up standing outside Bill's apartment building and... I wanted to make sure he was... really gone, you know... so I figured out which window was his and then I just started yelling, you know, "BILL, HEY BILL!!!"
JIMMY: "And then what happened?"
BETH: "Well, finally someone opened their window and yelled down, "Shut the hell up you crazy bitch!"
JOE: "That's just what Bill would've done."
BETH: "Yeah, and that just made me think... his spirit lives on in others." - Newsradio
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dark Lord:
Well if Rangers goes to a series I don't see why they can't use the same script, but just swap the main cast around.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>If that was possible, it'd be a bad script. Value Judgements is tied to the Excalibur crew... especially Matheson. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>If it's mainly concerning Garibaldi then it should need only light editing. So if Rangers does go to series, I wanna see that ep damnit!
laugh.gif
Garibaldi was one of the best characters in B5 IMO.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>You only get to see a hand and hear his name.



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You are not entitled to your own opinion. You are only entitled to your own informed opinion.
-- Harlan Ellison qouting Gustave Flaubert
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>If it's mainly concerning Garibaldi then it should need only light editing. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The problem is that there was never a Crusade script that was "mainly concerning Garibalidi".

One of the scripts discussed above would have featured him in short scene in his office on Mars, the other would have mentioned him a few times. Then at the end of the episodes he would have appeared on-screen for a few seconds in scene specifically written so that anyone of roughly the same build as Jerry Doyle could have stood in for the actor. (Garibaldi had no lines, and his face would never have been seen.)

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net
 
Ah, I thought he was gonna be in a large portion of an ep, chasing down Bester or something.

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BETH: "Well all I did was go for a really long walk."
JIMMY: "Where'd you go?"
BETH: "I don't know... I mean... all over the city, I guess... and then somehow I ended up standing outside Bill's apartment building and... I wanted to make sure he was... really gone, you know... so I figured out which window was his and then I just started yelling, you know, "BILL, HEY BILL!!!"
JIMMY: "And then what happened?"
BETH: "Well, finally someone opened their window and yelled down, "Shut the hell up you crazy bitch!"
JOE: "That's just what Bill would've done."
BETH: "Yeah, and that just made me think... his spirit lives on in others." - Newsradio
 
Try J. Gregory Keyes' Psi-Corps Trilogy. It doesn't make any reference to "Value Judgements" (as far as I can remember), but there are hints that Garibaldi is looking for him. But then that little tidbit is hardly a surprise either.
wink.gif


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Joe Medina (neargrai@aol.com)

"...that which are, we are"
 
As far as I know, the only B5 Characters written into Crusade eps were Bester (Value Judgements) and Lyta (Path of Sorrows). Garabaldi was to be shown in siloette basically and Sheridan is mentioned a few times. The Lennier in Path of Sorrows is a new one to me. Not saying it isn't true though. It's possible, though according to the Crusade Bible, Lennier dies around the time of B5:LotR.

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"There is always hope. Only because its the one thing no one's figured out how to kill yet."
 
Lenier's appearance, although most likely in such a way as to not need Mumy, would have been in a flashback. This contradicts nothing.

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"Yeah, we could start our own game where people throw ducks at balloons and nothing's the way it seems."-Homer
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Doctor Gonzo:
Lenier's appearance, although most likely in such a way as to not need Mumy, would have been in a flashback. This contradicts nothing.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This may be a bit off topic here, but I just want to say that I think Doctor Gonzo has the BEST picture here! I did not notice it before. That is the best shot of Vir!
laugh.gif


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"I do not believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense,
reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."-- Galileo
 
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