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Power of the VCD

C

Cleron

Regular
well just HOW powerfull is it ? ive seen it take on 3 Darak cruisers said to have 40 odd fighters each ie 120 and the VCD carries 56 T bolts but considering 2 raiders can take out a white star the VCD was facing some serious firepower....

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G'kar " No dictator no invader can hold an imprissioned population by force of arms .forever.. there is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom...against that power goverments and tirants and armies Cannot stand... The centuri learned this lession once ... We will teach it to them again... though it take a thousand years... We will be Free!"
 
A Drakh cruiser is simply a jump-capable platform for Drakh raiders. It isn't much of a fighting machine... more like a maintenance shed. On the other hand, the Drakh often customize their cruisers to serve different purposes.

A Drakh cruiser without raiders would be pretty helpless when facing a single White Star (a small ship designed to hurt capital ships like Shadow vessels).

Add a standard assortment of raiders -- and it will still be wasted by a handful of White Stars. Add surprise -- and most of the White Stars will come back unharmed.

I believe that the overall level of Excalibur's design, armor, weapons, interceptors, computers, fighters and power systems... make it comparable to (if not stronger than) a Minbari cruiser.

A Drakh cruiser has battled an Omega and destroyed it with some difficulty. Hordes of Omegas have been destroyed by Minbari cruisers. Thus it would be foolish to approach a Victory class destroyer with less than 6 fully prepared Drakh cruisers.

But as all indirect comparisons, this is very inaccurate. Excalibur might have a weak spot. Drakh cruisers, Omegas, White Stars, Sharlins -- they all have known and unknown weak spots. What is devastating against one may be irrelevant to another.

[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited October 21, 2001).]
 
well i my self think its secret is in its armor.... 15 meters of armor that can refract 80% of the damage is a MASSIVE advantage over other ships, the sharlin to would have a small refraction % but only around 10 - 20 so you have a ship with 4 QDC beams each of thoes is more powerfull than the sharlin flower beam...... thats a lot of fire power not to mention the 2 assult guns. i believe the vcd is able to take on 2 sharlins med - heavy damage but never the less a winner.
smile.gif
the vcd's main problem is the verry fact it has so few weapons witch makes it "possable" to nock them out in combat.

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G'kar " No dictator no invader can hold an imprissioned population by force of arms .forever.. there is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom...against that power goverments and tirants and armies Cannot stand... The centuri learned this lession once ... We will teach it to them again... though it take a thousand years... We will be Free!"
 
One thing to remember, is that the only statitistic you can trust that's out and about the Victory class is that they have armour that reflects about 80% of incoming energy. Anything else is speculation on unreliable sites (not naming any particular ones but the "15m of armour" quote rather points towards the biggest offender...).

Of course if AoG can get the Crusade licence sorted out (and the LotR one as well) we'll have some slightly better answers.

Could a VCD take a Sharlin? Probably - it's built with the best of Minbari and Earth tech, and is a darn sight bigger, plus carries a much larger fighter force (at least 18 Thunderbolts plus 12 Starfuries - count 'em yourself in "Each Night I Dream of Home")

Relatively few weapons? Not really - its fighter point defense is nothing short of stunning, and its forward punch is comparable to the likes of a Sharlin (before you consider the Big Vorlon Gun). Plus it's the heroes' ship - it'll always win
wink.gif


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Paddy Sinclair

"I think it's an excellent plan. But then, I've been shot through the head on five or six occasions"- Troop Leader Keitel, The Corps
 
no i mean its MAIN fire power "fwrd" comes from 4 QDC guns. no one knows just how much armor is on them but its a fair guess... when u consider the power of the weapons in the b5 world.


over all th VCD was said to out do any known ship.... n i believe it

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G'kar " No dictator no invader can hold an imprissioned population by force of arms .forever.. there is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom...against that power goverments and tirants and armies Cannot stand... The centuri learned this lession once ... We will teach it to them again... though it take a thousand years... We will be Free!"
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>
no i mean its MAIN fire power "fwrd" comes from 4 QDC guns. no one knows just how much armor is on them but its a fair guess... when u consider the power of the weapons in the b5 world.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

There's reasonable evidence there are six mounts in the front (though we only see four fire simultaneously) though I'd tend to call them INLs but that's just my background showing
wink.gif
The weapons themselves aren't heavily armoured (under heavy fire, both the Victory and the Excalibur seem to loose forward weaponary to damage quite quickly).

Pet subject of mine? What the weapons loadout of the Excalibur? Never!
smile.gif


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Paddy Sinclair

"I think it's an excellent plan. But then, I've been shot through the head on five or six occasions"- Troop Leader Keitel, The Corps
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lennier:
Hordes of Omegas have been destroyed by Minbari cruisers.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Strange, I cann't reacall any Omega been destroyed by Minbari cruiser. Novas and Hyperions - yes, but no Omegas
smile.gif

About power of Excalibur - I'd consider it rougly equal to Minbari cruiser (I donn't take Excalibur's main gun on account since it's weapon you use, when you are desparate or the enemy force is right in front of your ship). Some of it's other systems may be more powerful than those of Minbari cruiser, but then - Excalibur has Earth fihters instead of Minbari fighters.
Actually - I've never understood, why was Excalibur designed toc carry Earth fighters, since it was supposed to be Ranger's ship. And they use minbari fighters.



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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by virgo:
Actually - I've never understood, why was Excalibur designed toc carry Earth fighters, since it was supposed to be Ranger's ship. And they use minbari fighters.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Perhaps it had something to do with it being an Earth-Minbari cooperation project?

Or since it was meant for the Alliance, perhaps Earth fighters were more appropriate for both Human and Minbari pilots. The Minbari Nials may have been too uncomfortable for a Human to use, and maybe they didn't want to design a whole new fighter class just for the VCD ships?

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"It's animal magnetism. What can I say?"
- G'Kar, A Tragedy of Telepaths
Visit Kribu's Lounge - now completely ad-free!
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Actually - I've never understood, why was Excalibur designed toc carry Earth fighters, since it was supposed to be Ranger's ship. And they use minbari fighters.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Interesting point. This could also be because the ship was a prototype. Perhaps a later version would capable of carrying minbari fighters or both and they planed to update it later.
Also, perhaps the minbari government (or certain elements therein) felt giving humans their fighter technology(in addition to everything else) was giving up too much.

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"No, they never end as tales," said Frodo. "But the people in them come, and go when their part's ended. Our part will end later - or sooner." - Frodo to Sam in "The Stairs of Cirith Ungol" The Two Towers, The Lord of The Rings - J.R.R. Tolkien

[This message has been edited by Great_Dying (edited October 22, 2001).]
 
Yeah but don't forget the Excalibur is only on loan to the Earth Government. The reason it's development was so secretive was because the other races might react in a hostile manner when they saw a bigger meaner Ranger ship to the Whitestar (this was the thinking before the VCD's main weapon drawback was known), this was brought up in ACtA in a conversation between Garibaldi and Sheridan.

Excalibur probably didn't have a fighter compliment when it was first used, we certainly don't see one! The EA most likely supplied their own fighters and support ships when they were loaned it by the ISA.

It's likely that Excalibur would be equipped with Minbari fighters in the original scheme of things, as that is the standard fighter on the Whitestars and the Rangers would be familiar with them after the standard Minbari training.

On the other hand, I think Sheridan may have been trying to get humanity an (even)greater role in the Interstellar Alliance by developing ships with Earth controls as standard. You could quite easily pass this off by saying that the Earth control system is better because it is more basic and easier for races not as advanced as the Minbari to operate.

Lets not forget his little stunt in getting Earth access to not only Minbari but Vorlon tech. OK so it was limited to Edgars-Garibaldi Industries involvement, but sooner or later Sheridan must have realised that the technicians who worked on VCD's design (this is after the new prototypes are built following the shipyard getting toasted in ACtA), would eventually be working on EA contracts.

It's logical to assume that somewhere along the line, a new fighter is going to be designed too. Can you imagine what a Nial crossed with a Starfury might be capable of especially with a bit of vorlon tech thrown into the blend?
cool.gif


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"We Live for the One. We die for the One!"
 
There are some things we'd have to know about Victory class destroyers to evaluate their strength.

0. How much energy (and in which part of the spectrum) does their armour reflect and refract? The only "official" figure is a vague "up to 80%"...

How much for Drakh weapons?
How much for lasers?
How much for plasma?
How much for neutron cannons?
How much for Shadow & Vorlon beam weapons?

These values are bound to be different.

1. How efficiently does it diffuse the energy it has absorbed?

Like a Warlock?
Like a Sharlin?
Like a White Star?
Like a chunk of junk (Omega, Hyperion).
Like hell (Shadow battlecrab, Vorlon cruiser).

2. How much power can it produce?

That would depend on whether the reactors are from Earth, Minbar or some third party.

3. How efficiently can it use the power it produces? New things tend to be a bit inefficient. It would depend on the manufacturer and the origin of its components.

If it has a Vorlon main weapon, we may suspect that nobody knew how to install it. If it has a Minbari weapon, it may simply be too much for Earth reactors. But if it has a properly installed Vorlon weapon with Minbari reactors, I would stay faaar away from those ships.

4. How good sensors, targeting, stealth and computer systems does it have? Again the question is whether the parts are of Earth, Minbari or Vorlon origin. Or perhaps Earth-made systems of Shadow origin?

5. How good are Thunderbolts against Drakh raiders? How good would Minbari fighters be against Drakh raiders?

6. How fast can a VCD travel and manouver?

[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited October 22, 2001).]
 
Quantum Gravimetric reactor
no other way to get enough power for a vorlon based weapon.


they say It Refracts 80% implying there is little to no variance "Shrugs" i know this would probably be wrong in the real world but the fact is this is fiction lol

well in ACTA they both took a big beating so id say its quite effective


enough to fire a SQDC "vorlon Main Beam" witch means a Bloody lot


quote:
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4. How good sensors, targeting, stealth and computer systems does it have? Again the question is whether the parts are of Earth, Minbari or Vorlon origin. Or perhaps Earth-made systems of Shadow origin?
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the best.... can scan a shadow death cloud be run by "monkeys" LOL the computer system of course would be top of the line


they were fitted with t bolts for a simple reason its being used by earth force... it's nothing about "not being able to" it dam well could hold Minbari or any other fighter for that matter its just the fact its in "earth hands"


Quantum Gravimetric reactor once again this means that its very good in this area not only that in ACTA this is braught up n its a mix of Earth minbari and vorlon tech "i think" so what ever it is..... its very good


you have to remember some thing.... Most of the tech in the VCD is not Earth or Mibari or even Vorlon it's usually a Hybrid and tweaked if not. so the fact is this IS the ship to be in


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G'kar " No dictator no invader can hold an imprissioned population by force of arms .forever.. there is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom...against that power goverments and tirants and armies Cannot stand... The centuri learned this lession once ... We will teach it to them again... though it take a thousand years... We will be Free!"

[This message has been edited by Cleron (edited October 22, 2001).]
 
According to the book 'To Dream in the City of Sorrows' the Ranger fighters were concept testers for the Whitestars. In the thread about why the Excalibur does not have Vorlon Organic armour I suggested that only the Vorlons could make it, the Minbari just fit it. The same restriction would apply to the Ranger fighters.

My answer is that the Excalibur has Starfuries because the Minbari cannot make Ranger fighters.


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Andrew Swallow
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>only the Vorlons could make it, the Minbari just fit it<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Initially quite probable, but...

In "Sleeping in Light" we see Sheridan using a personal flyer designed very much like a White Star. The question of whether it has organic armour or not has (as far as I know) never been proved or disproved. But this may not have anything to do with Excalibur - "SiL" is 20 years into the future.

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"We are the universe, trying to figure itself out.
Unfortunately we as software lack any coherent documentation."
-- Delenn
 
There is 15 years between 'A Call to Arms' and 'Sleeping in Light', plenty of time for a research programme to produce results. Particularly if the Minbari stated it in B5 Season 1.

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Andrew Swallow
 
in acta it was stated it would take 6 months to grow the bio armor on the hull.... this is after they leave "vorlons".... also i dont think vorlons would come running to us with new "bio armor" every time a white star got a bloody nose "witch is a LOT"

if they give you tech, they give you tech... theres is no middle ground vorlons are "yes" or no type of people even though there answer are cryptic

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G'kar " No dictator no invader can hold an imprissioned population by force of arms .forever.. there is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom...against that power goverments and tirants and armies Cannot stand... The centuri learned this lession once ... We will teach it to them again... though it take a thousand years... We will be Free!"
 
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