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How do you like your DVDs?

Londonium

Beyond the rim
Well it sems that things are looking hopeful for more B5 DVDs.

In what form would you prefer the episodes be released on disc?

All of one season in a box set of several discs (like Sopranos and Sex & The City),

Or single discs with several episodes, with a new DVD coming out every few weeks/months (like Farscape and Lexx)?

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I'd take them in any form.
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For personal reasons, I wouldn't mind having them released one disk at a time, with 4 episodes or so. (Because with a box set, the price would probably be so high that I'd have to pay 18% VAT on top of the actual price + shipping.)

Box sets would make the most sense, however. It would be great to have a whole season out at once. Yeah, you'd have to wait longer for each new release (new box set) but it would be the most convenient.

With individual disks I might also be tempted to pick and choose... and I know that this is not the right way.
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"Narns, Humans, Centauri... we all do what we do for the same reason: because it seems like a good idea at the time." - G'Kar, Mind War
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com
 
Season by season box sets. Priced similarly to the SG-1 season 1 box set (which I just ordered along with the B5 DVD from Amazon).

But to be honest, I'll buy it any way it's released as long as they don't do 'best of' releases.
 
Season box sets in Letterbox format 16 x 9 enhanced.
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If they later decide to rerelease special edition versions with audio remix of 5.1 Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital EX, DTS ES or any other "extras" I'll buy them again.
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I would also prefer a season-by-season release.

I am undecided about video quality. Video quality has never stopped me from enjoying a good movie. I believe they will use the best quality which can be achieved with reasonable expenses. Neither am I too picky about sound quality: everything comparable to standard CD quality will be fine.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Because with a box set, the price would probably be so high that I'd have to pay 18% VAT on top of the actual price.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

But in case of single disks you might have to order them separately, which would increase shipment costs. A boxed set is the most economical way -- perhaps even economical enough to balance the VAT?

[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited December 07, 2001).]
 
Season by season boxed sets in widescreen. Everything else is negotiable.

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"Crying isn't gonna get your dog back. Unless your tears smell like dog food. So you can sit here eating can after can of dog food until your tears smell like dog food or you can go out there and find your dog."-Homer in The Canine Mutiny
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lennier:
But in case of single disks you might have to order them separately, which would increase shipment costs. A boxed set is the most economical way -- perhaps even economical enough to balance the VAT?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't think so. Depends on the price of the box set but if it's in the region of $100 or so, then I figure VAT would be higher than shipping cost of individual disks (and one could always order 2 or perhaps 3 at a time to lower shipping cost).

But it won't really matter that much. Season by season box sets would be the best way to go, even though not the most economical for some of us (I just don't get why the limit over which you have to pay VAT has to be so low here... I think it goes at about $60 now).

And I would love to see some extras in those sets - if you have, say, 4 episodes per disk, then there would be just enough room for some good stuff on the last disk in the set.
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"Narns, Humans, Centauri... we all do what we do for the same reason: because it seems like a good idea at the time." - G'Kar, Mind War
Kribu's Lounge | kribu@ranger.b5lr.com
 
Season by season boxed sets with extras: interveiws, behind the scene, out takes. etc. etc. ... in widescreen. Ohhhh, it would be great!

Now if my DVD would only get here...

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Faith Manages
 
How much you can fit on a DVD depends on how many sides and layers it has:

One side, one layer: about 4 GB.
One side, two layers: about 8 GB.
Two sides, one layer: about 8 GB.
Two sides, two layers: about 16 GB.

It is a matter of size versus price. Unfortunately I don't know which disks are the most economical. My guess would be 2 sides and 1 layer. These would be the preferred media for larger releases.

So we have roughly 8 GB per disk.

Now how much space does one episode take? How do they compress? How many megabytes per minute? I can't answer that before I have the "In the Beginning" and "Gathering" in my DVD drive.

But I can still guess. Two telemovies are roughly equal to four episodes, are they not? So the most probable number would be four episodes per disk, thus 5,5 disks per season.

Half of the last disk will be free for special features. And this is a suggestion indeed, Warner.
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[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited December 07, 2001).]
 
I, too, would prefer season by season box sets, but I doubt they will do it that way. It seems more likely that they will follow the Farscape model, since the two niche markets (Farscape and B5) are very similar.

As far as bonus features I am not expecting much either. Frankly it wouldn't make much business sense for Warner to spend money on bonus features because we will all buy the discs regardless. (If I were Warner, I'd take advantage of all us suckers and pump those discs out as cheaply as I could).

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Viruses come and viruses go, but syndromes are forever.
 
Just so long as they release region 2, season by season is good. Wouldn't mind a few screensavey/ wallpapery goodies on the extras disk.

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Lyta had a little Vorlon
Her skin was pale as snow
And everywhere that Lyta went
Her Vorlon was sure to go.
 
Season by season box sets is the way to go but I would take them in any form as my tapes are getting pretty darn thin.

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"When it is time, come to this place, call our name, we will be here" -Walkers of Sigma957
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Now how much space does one episode take? How do they compress? How many megabytes per minute?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It varies.
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That's one of the things that makes DVD work, the variable bitrate compression of MPEG-2. So things that compress well (like relatively static scenes where not much changes from frame to frame) can have the heck compressed out of them without loss of quality, while "busy" scenes can be allocated more bits. MPEG-1 used a fixed bitrate scheme, which is why VCDs are often blocky and pixelated during scenes with lots of motion. So there is a good chance that no two episodes will take up exactly the same amount of disc space, and that's why DVD capacity is expressed in megabytes, not time units.

The rule of thumb, however, is that you can get about 2 hours per layer - regardless of whether there are two layers on one side, or one layer on each side of a disc. (In practice, the second layer of a two-layer disc holds slightly less than the first.)

So you can easily put 4 episodes on one side of a two-layered disc, as Fox does with The X-Files and still have room for some extras like commentary tracks and deleted scenes. More extensive and less episode-specific extras can and should go on either a supplemental disc or the last disc in the set - assuming that has space left over. Doing two episodes per side of a two-side disc adds no advantage, while making it more annoying to run straight through the contents. (The show is a whole different experience when you watch several episodes back-to-back-to-back, as many of us have discovered when watching an EP tape with many episodes on it.)

Anyway, that's how I prefer to watch them. Two-sided, dual-layered discs (DVD-18) would allow for fewer discs, but aside from saving a little storage space, they don't offer any real advantages. Disc replication is one of the cheapest parts of DVD production. It is the fixed cost of actually mastering each episode that absorbs most of the money - and that's going to have to be spent regardless of how many episodes go on each disc. So WHV wouldn't be able to sell a 3-disc DVD-18 season set at a substantially cheaper price than a 6-disc DVD-9 (dual-layered, single-sided) set. In fact, the DVD-18s might end up costing more.

Production yields of DVD-18 are lower because a flaw in any one of four layers means the disc has to be junked. Even when they pass factory QA, DVD-18s often have undetected problems that show up when consumers get them - leading to higher rates of returns and replacements. (The 1 disc version of the T2: Ultimate Edition was a nightmare for the studio and fans alike.)

Finally production capacity for DVD-18 is limited. There are only one or two replication facilities that are set up to handle the "double double" discs, which can lead to competing studios paying a premium to get time on those production lines.

Then there is the psychological factor. Paying $100 or so for a six-disc set "feels" more reasonable than paying the same amount for three discs to many people - even if they know intellectually that they are paying for the same content. This was one of the reasons that Fox Home Video Chief Peter Staddon told me that Fox will not use DVD-18 and definitely prefers two-disc special edition releases to cramming everything onto a single disc.

DVD-18 also makes it impossible to use silk-screen artwork on the disc, and forces the label information into the tiny space around the hub. (I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting to the point where I can't read that tiny print.
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) This is another thing that adds to the perceived "value" of the set - and for good reason.

Lastly, DVD-18s - because they have data on both sides - are more prone to damage than DVD-9s. If the phone rings and you have to put a 9 down on the table, you can set it down data side up and not worry about it. If your finger slips off the edge on the label side, you don't have to worry about finger prints messing up the playback. You have to be a lot more careful in handling a DVD-18.

So for a host of business and practical reasons, I suspect that Warner Bros. will follow the Fox model and release boxed sets with four episodes per DVD-9 disc, with supplements on disc 6. (I hope.
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) I'm very sure that they will be going with boxed sets. WHV concluded a long time ago that the B5 audience is more like the X-Files crowd than it is any other, and that a similar release would be the only one that fans would accept. It is precisely because they know that an expensive full-season set with at least some extras is the minimum that fans will buy that they issued the TV movie disc to check the size of the market. They didn't want to spend a ton of money mastering 22 episodes and distributing a $100 set that nobody wanted to buy.

Fox took a huge gamble doing this with The X-Files, and the other studios expected them to fall on their faces when they did it. It was Fox's success, combined with the lukewarm response to Paramount's earlier ST:TOS discs, that changed the thinking at WHV. However they were also aware that at its best the B5 audience is a fraction the size of the X-Files fanbase, and they had seen the VHS tapes tank. They also knew that there was a lot of interest in the widescreen version of the show - but there was no way that they were going to pay for new widescreen masters. Once Warner Bros. Television and The Sci-Fi Channel solved that problem for them, most of the pieces were in place for releasing the series, which is why they announced that they planned to do so a little over a year ago.

(The screw-up with the Sci-Fi widescreen masters probably delayed the project - which was projected to start with S1 this November or December - somewhat. In the meantime they started getting cold feet again and decided to rush out a cheap "test disc" to reassure themselves that somebody was really going to buy those boxed sets when they came.)

I'd say now is the time to start snail-mailing WHV with suggestions for extras. I am also agitating for WHV to abandon - in this unique situation - their reliance on the horrible cardboard "snapper" case. For once they should go outside the company that they own and use a case that is really designed for this kind of multi-disc release - the folding "accordian" case that Fox developed for X-Files. It is incredibly compact (a 7-disc X-Files set requires less shelf-space than my 5-disc U.K. version of The Prisoner.) It is an attractive design with tons of room for artwork, both inside, outside and on the "slipcase". Besides, I can just imagine a side-panel mural with the station stretching across all five seasons, and portraits of the various characters surrounding it.
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Even Paramount has learned its lesson in this regard. All indications are that when ST: TNG arrives on DVD next spring it will do so in season boxed sets - released every two or three months, instead of every six months as Fox is doing with X-Files.

Here's an Associated Press article on how the season boxed set phenomenon is taking over the TV-show-on DVD business:

DVDs Can Hold Entire TV Seasons

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division

joseph-demartino@att.net

[This message has been edited by Joseph DeMartino (edited December 07, 2001).]
 
It is reassuring to learn that double-sided single-layer disks are not significantly cheaper. I somehow imagined them to be... and had mentally discarded the single-sided double-layer option.

Single-sided disks are truly more attractive, having more information visible on disk. I just imagined that they would also be more expensive.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Lastly, DVD-18s - because they have data on both sides - are more prone to damage than DVD-9s. If the phone rings and you have to put a 9 down on the table, you can set it down data side up and not worry about it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The only part which I would like to give a friendly nitpicking.
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I recall reading that the data layer is actually much closer to the label than the reading surface. This is why I would imagine the label to be much more vulnerable than the transparent side.

Scratches on the transparent side are overcome by a properly focused laser (the beam is still nearly a millimeter wide when crossing the surface) and can be removed with careful polishing. Scratches on the label side may damage data much more easily (at least in case of a CD).

[This message has been edited by Lennier (edited December 07, 2001).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Scratches on the label side may damage data much more easily (at least in case of a CD).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This may be true, but there is another "layer" involved, the ink of the silk-screened label itself. This provides protection from minor scratches in and or itself. (I also believe that there is a further transparent plastic layer below the label to protect the data from the ink. The very first music CDs had a problem with the label ink actually attacking the aluminum - or aluminium
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- substrate after six months or a year, and I'm pretty sure this was the fix.)

Either way, a DVD-9 is less trouble-prone than an -18, which can only be handled by its edges.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division

joseph-demartino@att.net
 
Oh yeah, duh, I just realised that if they put 4 eps per disk, that would leave the last disk with only two eps, leaving lots of room for extras. Peachy keen, as the kids say.

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"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Londonium:
How do you like your DVDs?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sunny side up.



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Anyone got an animal, vegetable or mineral spare?

"You're going to die screaming and I'm going to watch."
-- Charlie, The Long Kiss Goodnight.
 
Definately season by season. Hopefully they wouldn't do somethign stupid like putting only 2 on a disk (like Star Trek). Although, if they did release the whole series in one set, say around a December release, that would make a nice little gift that I wouldn't have to spend money on (wink wink nudge nudge parents). Waiting between releases would certainly be torture!!!

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We're all born as molecules in the hearts of a billion stars, molecules that do not understand politics, policies and differences. In a billion years we, foolish molecules forget who we are and where we came from. Desperate acts of ego. We give ourselves names, fight over lines on maps. And pretend our light is better than everyone else's. The flame reminds us of the piece of those stars that live inside us. A spark that tells us: you should know better. The flame also reminds us that life is precious, as each flame is unique. When it goes out, it's gone forever. And there will never be another quite like it
 
Season box sets
widescreen
preferably anamorphic

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No one here is exactly what he appears.
G'Kar - Andreas Katsulas

Nothing's the same anymore.
Commander Sinclair - Michael O'Hare

Babylon 5
 

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