Did "Passing Through Gethsemane" change Garibaldi?

[The_One]

Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

I was watching this episode the other day, and it raises more moral questions than you can shake a Minbari fighting pike at.

Rather than share our views on all of them at once (although I'm sure that has been done many times before), I wondered whether anyone else thought it "changed" Garibaldi?

He states at the beginning of the episode he is against the idea of the mind wipe, and that he is an "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth kind of guy." And yet, when he discovers what has happened to Brother Edward, this aspect of the story does not seem to resurface. I don't know whether or not it may have been addressed in a deleted scene, but I think JMS missed a character building opportunity here. I'd like to think that Garibaldi did learn something, as he seemed to quite like Brother Edward.

I think the over riding message of this episode is that we should not judge people on who they were, but who they are - and that forgiveness may be a hard thing, but we should always strive to give it. Do you think Garibaldi learnt this?

 

[Jade Jaguar]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

I think it made Garibaldi think a bit, but I doubt that it changed his position much, he's a stubborn fellow. Didn't we get a brief reaction, when G. found out? I seem to remember him reacting with sadness.

To me, the real twist was with Sheridan. For most of the ep, he couldn't understand others' unwillingness to consider Bro. Edward based only on his new identity. But then, when he was confronted with Bro. Edward's killer in a new identity, he had the same problem, producing an internal struggle to accept the 'new' person. That's a very human response, when our gut tries to over-rule our head.

 

[iamsheridan]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

You could ask the same about Sheridan. I don't remember - did he shake the new brother's hand? He gave him his blessing - but did he mean it?

Garibaldi used to have a much tougher attitude, but being an intelligent person I'm sure at least he got something to think about.

I know I did!

The most thought provoking episodes of all, IMHO.
/ IAS

 

[KoshFan]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

Yes, Sheridan shook the new brother's hand and gave him his blessing... at Brother Theo's sharp prompting. I think Sheridan realized his hypocrisy, so he probably meant both.

 

[grumbler]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

I always thought the episode ended on an interesting note of uncertainty: how heartfelt WAS that handshake?

It was a fascinating episode. That, and A Late Delivery... were my two favorite non-arc episodes.

 

[Jade Jaguar]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

It seemed that Sheridan was gritting his teeth to me. I think that intellectually, he knew he should accept the new brother, but, being human, emotionally, he saw him as the killer of someone he admired.

 

[iamsheridan]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

It seemed that Sheridan was gritting his teeth to me. I think that intellectually, he knew he should accept the new brother, but, being human, emotionally, he saw him as the killer of someone he admired.

Me too!

And I actually reacted the same way myself. It's hard to look at yourself from the outside and realize that "You're not as good as you think you are". <shudder>

/ IAS

 

[A_M_Swallow]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

It takes time to forgive.

 

[RW7427]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

Well, since Brother Edward was a killer that was changed into a new, gentler person, I wonder if Sheridan thought the same could be true of the man that killed Brother Edward.

 

[B5_Obsessed]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

This is the second time Garibaldi's been acquainted with an artificial personality. In light of how Talia turned out, I would think this repeat incident would only make him angry and increasingly paranoid. He got fooled twice. You know he hates that.

 

[Sindatur]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

This is the second time Garibaldi's been acquainted with an artificial personality. In light of how Talia turned out, I would think this repeat incident would only make him angry and increasingly paranoid. He got fooled twice. You know he hates that.

Completely opposite ends of the spectrum. Talia was altered and placed on B5 in order to be a spy, and later changed back to cause damage. Whereas Brother Theo's people were altered in order to prevent anymore damage being done to anyone, and to repay some of the damage that was done by their former personalities.

 

[B5_Obsessed]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

Yes, but the effect on Garibaldi would be the same regardless. I'd expect him to just drop his hands and scream, "STOP F***ING AROUND INSIDE PEOPLE'S HEADS!"

 

[Jan]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

Yes, but the effect on Garibaldi would be the same regardless. I'd expect him to just drop his hands and scream, "STOP F***ING AROUND INSIDE PEOPLE'S HEADS!"

Isn't that why he's in favor of 'electric bleachers'? <g>

Jan

 

[Demon]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

Yes, but the effect on Garibaldi would be the same regardless. I'd expect him to just drop his hands and scream, "STOP F***ING AROUND INSIDE PEOPLE'S HEADS!"

Which given what Bester eventually does to him, is ironic

 

[B5_Obsessed]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

Yes, but the effect on Garibaldi would be the same regardless. I'd expect him to just drop his hands and scream, "STOP F***ING AROUND INSIDE PEOPLE'S HEADS!"

Which given what Bester eventually does to him, is ironic

Third time's a charm, eh?

 

[A_M_Swallow]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

As shown in 'Mindwar' Garibaldi did not like Bester reading his mind.

 

[Demon]

Re: Did \"Passing Through Gethsemane\" change Garibaldi?

I think that could be the understatement of the century