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Old August 14th 10, 12:02   #411
GKarsEye
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Re: Buffy the Vampire Slayer

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Ah, you were the ideal target audience for the first few episodes, then... I'll be excited to tell them about you over on the Whedon site I go to. We thought you were a myth.
You're giving me this impression that the internet of full of pretentious Whedon fan-boys who think the shows they like are some fancy intellectual artsy thing.

Let's remember we're talking about fucking vampires and shit.

The genius of Buffy is that is hooks you with action and eye-candy, and then brings in the more mature and clever story-telling and character stuff. But it's still about a hot chick and her buddies killing monsters. Yes I liked the most involved stuff in Buffy and Dollhouse (it's what justified the long run of the first), but without the hook, the basic premise, there is no show.

I dunno man, I guess I'm glad I'm done with my days of hardcore fanboy-ism, because from what you're telling me, the Whedon faithful aren't very faithful. If JMS had a new show I'd watch it and give it every chance, 'cause he earned it. Now I don't hold Whedon in quite that high regard, but he's still earned the right to be given the benefit of the doubt. Also, Eliza Dushku on motorcycles and little dresses!
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Old August 14th 10, 14:54   #412
Sindatur
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Re: Buffy the Vampire Slayer

KF, perhaps I'm being stereotypical, or simply just going by own experiences, but, I received many replies on the internet from women when trying to convince them to watch longer, and give it a chance to play out and the mysogyny was what they complained about (and in some cases, they had never seen it, and after trying it out on my reccomendation, were not pleased.). And my mom had the same reaction when I loaned her my DVD copies (though she also cited lack of likable characters)

As far as exploiting male dolls, Victor was really the only one we saw to any degree in the first half of Season 1, which is where most of the audience losses occured, plus, I don't think you're ever going to get the same response from an audience when a man is being sexually exploited as you will from a woman being exploited in the same manner (Not that I condone that, but, it's the way the world thinks in general)
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Old August 14th 10, 17:59   #413
KoshFan
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Re: Buffy the Vampire Slayer

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Originally Posted by GKarsEye View Post
You're giving me this impression that the internet of full of pretentious Whedon fan-boys who think the shows they like are some fancy intellectual artsy thing.
Certain corners of the internet are full of people like that. And yes, we need to get out more. Thing is, we got this nice little groupthink feedback loop going, where we think we're the entire internet or even the world, and going outside our comfort zone would mess with that.

It's true, however, that we see so much truth and beauty in the shows that we forget even Joss refers to his actors as "the cheesecake."

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Originally Posted by GKarsEye View Post
I dunno man, I guess I'm glad I'm done with my days of hardcore fanboy-ism, because from what you're telling me, the Whedon faithful aren't very faithful. If JMS had a new show I'd watch it and give it every chance, 'cause he earned it. Now I don't hold Whedon in quite that high regard, but he's still earned the right to be given the benefit of the doubt. Also, Eliza Dushku on motorcycles and little dresses!
Oh, a lot of Whedon fans showed up to start with. They just didn't stick around. Thing is, Whedon fans get to be that way because of Firefly, Buffy, Angel, and Dr. Horrible, which are all rather disparate things. You'd never get 100% of all Whedon fans to agree on any of his shows, actually. Personally, my regard for Angel is lower than the rest. So if you show up expecting Cap'n Tightpants and his close-knit crew, or if you show up expecting Eliza's tiny dresses to be justified by her being a consistently strong female character...

Still, I stuck it out. I don't own a TV but I watched every episode on Hulu, and bought the S1 DVDs. So did a lot of other people.

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Originally Posted by Sindatur View Post
KF, perhaps I'm being stereotypical, or simply just going by own experiences, but, I received many replies on the internet from women when trying to convince them to watch longer, and give it a chance to play out and the mysogyny was what they complained about (and in some cases, they had never seen it, and after trying it out on my reccomendation, were not pleased.).
Oh, wasn't denying the truth of your statement, I was just pointing out it wasn't the whole truth. And I used excessively loaded language in the process. Mea culpa.
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