In LotR will they show the ship G'Kar left b5 in?

In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

It makes you think, how will they introduce citizen G'Kar in Legend of the Rangers? Whenever he shows up I hope they show a nice close up of the ship he left B5 in at the end of season 5. Remember it was this cool looking purple thing, it almost looked organic.

Does anyone have any pics of it?

Anyhow all I want is one good close up CGI shot of that bad boy.

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Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

The movie is set in the year after G'Kar and Lyta return from their journey. It is quite possible that G'Kar no longer has the ship, since he probably doesn't plan on any other trips of a similar duration.

As for "organic looking" - I doubt this means anything. G'Kar bought a used spaceship on the open market. Since none of the younger races has done much with organic technology, it seems unlikely that G'Kar managed to stumble across such a thing. It would be a little like finding a Stealth Fighter at Honest John's Used Car City.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

Well there was that kid who collected all thouse pepsi points, I think thats what they were, and tried to claim the harrier jet that they were advertising for a million points. Maybe G'kar stumbled across an old Vorlon ship in the smae way.

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Scott Gifford

Please pardon the spelling errors, grammer errors and various sarcastic overtures

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

Beware of Movie Studios offering "great prizes".

I met the guy who won the Batmobile the studio gave away after the first movie.

When they first notified him, he thought he'd really scored.

Then, they delivered it and he discovered the Truth.

No Engine. Not only that, they'd welded Rebar into the engine compartment and poured in Concrete to make Certain no one would ever Put one in.

At least not without destroying the car.

Plus, while it had an appraised value of about $100,000, the contract he had to sign to take possesion forbid him from using it to make Money.

He couldn't charge admission to look at it.
He couldn't Sell it to anyone but the Studio.

But, he DID owe Income Taxes on the value of the car.
And he was a Student.
With no place to Park it.

He ended up making a deal with the local Science Center. They helped him get a deal to load it on a Truck that could be used to haul it around for exhibit at Science Centers (free of charge). The Science Centers would pay for transport and insurance. Because They could use it as Bait for increasing paid admissions after people had admired the Batmobile.

I'm not sure how they worked things out with the IRS. Maybe a good tax advisor could find a way to use the restrictions to argue that the car was really worthless.
After all, to the "Winner" it was actually a Liability.


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Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

He first appears lurking in the shadows... so he's kind of 'already there'.

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"Love isn't brains, children, it's blood. Blood screaming inside you to work its will. I may be love's bitch, but at least I'm man enough to admit it." -- Spike, Buffy the Vampire Slayer

"Evil's still afoot. And I'm almost out of that nancy-boy hair-gel I like so much. Quickly, to the Angel-mobile, away." -- Spike, as Angel, in Angel

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

It was a very pretty little ship...

But I agree with Joe - he probably wouldn't have much use for an explorer ship once he's back from his travels.

My guess is he either sold it - cheap, since it must have had considerably more light-years on it after those two years than the 240 when he bought it - or just given it away.

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"It's animal magnetism. What can I say?"
- G'Kar, A Tragedy of Telepaths

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

Or gave it to Lyta.

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Andrew Swallow

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> he probably wouldn't have much use for an explorer ship once he's back from his travels.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That assumes two facts "not in evidence".

1. He's home to stay.
2. He has no plans to do any future traveling between the IA worlds.

If he is just stopping by for a visit before heading out again, he'd still need the ship.

If he's planning to hang around the Neighborhood, he might still prefer to have his own Personal runabout. It would save him the agravation of booking flights.

It would also make it very difficult for any remaining Narn "followers" to keep track of his travels.
G'Kar doesn't want to find bunches of Narn Nuisances waiting for him at every spaceport he visits.

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Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

That's true, bakana. I suppose I figured that using commercial transport - shuttles etc - would do that sort of job just fine. Or get something simpler for everyday travels that takes less fuel than an explorer ship.

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"It's animal magnetism. What can I say?"
- G'Kar, A Tragedy of Telepaths

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>That assumes two facts "not in evidence".

1. He's home to stay.

2. He has no plans to do any future traveling between the IA worlds.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Possible rebuttal:

1. Internal evidence from the short stories and novels suggests that G'Kar avoids Narn, but otherwise stays around in the general vicinity of IA space.

2. This depends on how much future travelling he plans to do, and who is paying for it. I used to do a lot of travelling professionally, but I never owned a private jet.

A ship, especially a long-range exploration vessel, is going to be expensive to maintain, even if it isn't being used much. (Ask anyone who owns a boat, especially a sea-going one, or a plane.) The more it is used the more it costs in fuel, and docking fees, the less it is used, the more it cost to keep it somewhere.

If G'Kar goes resumes his position with the Interstellar Alliance (and it seems he does) he'll have access to IA transports in addition to normal commercial ships, and either way the Alliance should be able to provide security by concealing is itinerary. (No problem on military or government transports, easy to do by booking commercial flights under a false name and travelling with forged documents - something IA security should be adept at, especially with Tessa Halloran in charge.)

BTW, does anyone wonder how G'Kar can afford all this travel? Even a used spaceship has to cost some serious coin. Then there's food, fuel and other staples en route, plus "port charges" and the like, plus food and lodging while he and Lyta are groundside. Maybe Garibaldi slipped Lyta a few hundred thousand credits from the secret fund before they left? (As a passenger, she'd be expected to kick-in for "gas money", one would think.) But G'Kar had planned to make the trip whether or not Lyta joined him. How was he going to pay for it?

Did he get a lump-sum payment of his back salary as a member of the Ka'Ri (sp?) from the time of the Centauri occupation until Narn was liberated? Do Narn government employees make that much? Was he independently wealthy before the show started? If so, how did his wealth survive the bombing and occupation, which must have devastated the Narn economy?

Maybe he had a rich wife with a fat insurance policy at some point.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino:
BTW, does anyone wonder how G'Kar can afford all this travel?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Royalties from his best-selling book?

Actually, I seem to remember from somewhere (the book Blood Oath?) that his never-in-the-series-mentioned wife (that everyone seems to have conveniently forgotten) was from a wealthy family. Perhaps she died in the bombing of Narn and G'Kar just collected the life insurance, plus the inheritance.

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"It's animal magnetism. What can I say?"
- G'Kar, A Tragedy of Telepaths

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

One assumption I keep seeing is referring to G'Kar's ship as an "Explorer" ship. It wasn't. It was a little two person runabout.

More of a tiny Yacht/scout/prospector ship than anything else. It didn't even seem to have as many sensors as Catherine Sakai's prospector ship.

The only Explorer ship we ever saw was almost as big as Babylon 5 itself.


For what it's worth, G'Kar didn't say he was going out to the Rim or anything. He was just going to go play Tourist on worlds the Interstellar Alliance didn't have any regular contact with.

As such, he was probably also playing unofficial "ambassador" to some of those worlds for Sheridan & Delenn.

Which might also answer the question of where at least Some of the money came from.

G'Kar did have considerable wealth. When the Narn Assassin came after him, he offered to Double the payment. And the Assassin answered that he had no doubts that G'Kar could afford it.

Then, after they turned the tables on the assassin, G'Kar deposited a large enough sum of money in the Assassin's accounts to make it believable that he Had bribed him.

Considering the risks of such an act for the assassin, it must have been a Lot of money to be convincing.

And, considering what G'Kar was doing (buying weapons, etc.) both During the Narn/Centauri war and afterward, he must have had a Lot of money stashed in accounts where no one would ever find it without his help.

Both personal and Government accounts. After all, G'Kar was an Arms dealer himself during the Earth Minbari war. Even if it was a Government job, he had lots of opportunity to toss in a few Private deals on the side.

I'd bet That money never got back to Narn. It'd stay in offplanet accounts until G'Kar needed it.


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Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

Given that G'Kar is the most influencial Narn alive it doesn't all that hard for him to get funds. I imagine that his governemtn would be happy to supply him wiht funds and his followers the same. however G'kar may not be willing to take this aid. Also it seems very likly that G'kar could keep funds off world. Many wealthy peopl today keep accoutns in many nations to prevent against total loss if one country goes under.

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Scott Gifford

Please pardon the spelling errors, grammer errors and various sarcastic overtures

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

The Lurker's Guide says "explorer" ship.

Not explorer-class (which would be the big ones) but "explorer ship" nevertheless. I assumed they meant a ship capable of exploring, i.e. longer-range travelling than e.g. an ordinary shuttle.

I admit, a scout/survey ship would probably be more correct.

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"It's animal magnetism. What can I say?"
- G'Kar, A Tragedy of Telepaths

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>And, considering what G'Kar was doing (buying weapons, etc.) both During the Narn/Centauri war and afterward, he must have had a Lot of money stashed in accounts where no one would ever find it without his help.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

He specifically tells the arms dealer that the weapons are being paid for by what little the off-world Narns have been able to scrape together, and that their funds are limited. This would seem to suggest that his access to cash during the Centauri occupation was severly restricted. The Centauri may have located G'Kar's assets and either frozen or (more likely) confiscated them. Maybe he got some of his money back out of the war reparations.

Funds would almost certainly be offered by his followers, which he would reject on principle, and by the government, which he would likely reject so as to avoid being beholden to the political establishment of the moment.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Not explorer-class (which would be the big ones) but "explorer ship" nevertheless.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Exactly. The Explorer-class ship we saw was EarthForce's idea of a very-long range, long-endurance ship for charting unexplored territory. The Explorer-class ships carry several disassembled jumpgates aboard them, and drop them in any systems that they think look interesting after a preliminary sweep. Then robot probes and finally scout-ships like Skydancer go in to confirm the presence of mineral wealth or habitable planets.

G'Kar's ship wouldn't be akin to this. It is more like an ocean-going yacht than it is an aircraft carrier. But it is also unlike a coastal pleasure boat that is not designed to stay at sea for weeks or months at a stretch. It would have greater fuel, water and food capacity, a more comfortable cabin, better electronics. (I can't imagine how anyone was able to deduce that it had "few sensors" than Skydancer based on the one, brief, glimpse we get of it sitting in a docking bay.)

In other words it would be generally more self-sufficient - the difference between a motor home and a passenger bus. Both will get you where you want to go, and both have toilets, but the bus can't stray far from food and lodgings. You can't live on a bus.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net

[This message has been edited by Joseph DeMartino (edited September 09, 2001).]

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

Before his Great Spiritual Enlightenment, G'Kar was a sneaky, vicious, ambitious son of a bitch. His climg to power almost certainly involved acquiring wealth. Who knows what kind of dirty dealings he had?

Another possibility is that he was given the money by those in his government who didn't want him to return to Narn. Mabye they figured they'd just give him a ship and let him fly out of their hair.

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"You do not make history. You can only hope to survive it."

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GKarsEye:
Mabye they figured they'd just give him a ship and let him fly out of their hair.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Wasn't the ship given to Lyta in exchange for her sharing teep DNA with them?


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You are not entitled to your own opinion. You are only entitled to your own informed opinion.
-- Harlan Ellison qouting Gustave Flaubert

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>I seem to remember from somewhere (the book Blood Oath?) that his never-in-the-series-mentioned wife (that everyone seems to have conveniently forgotten) was from a wealthy family.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The "Lurker's Guide" character sketch for G'Kar, which I think derives from either the series bible or early publicity materials, says that much of G'Kar's power and reputation comes from his late wife's status as a hero of the war of liberation. I suspect this idea was later dropped. It could easily have ended up in Blood Oath from the same source, since many of the early books were written by writers who had never seen the show, and they were not reviewed by JMS or anyone else at Babylonian prior to publication.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Before his Great Spiritual Enlightenment, G'Kar was a sneaky, vicious, ambitious son of a bitch. His climg to power almost certainly involved acquiring wealth. Who knows what kind of dirty dealings he had?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Both the points in your message are good ones. It still raises the question of how his wealth survived subsequent events, though. I suppose it is possible that he kept the bulk of it off-world, probably converted to another currency (which it would have to be since Narn currency would probably have been severly devalued after the second Centauri occupation.)

Given that G'Kar was based on Earth for a time, at EarthDome in Geneva, it is entirely possible that he discovered the advantages of the Swiss banking system and opened a numbered account, just like all the sleazy Human politicians do.

Regards,

Joe

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Joseph DeMartino
Sigh Corps
Pat Tallman Division
joseph-demartino@att.net

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR> He specifically tells the arms dealer that the weapons are being paid for by what little the off-world Narns have been able to scrape together, and that their funds are limited. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Would YOU tell a crook anything about Your financial resources??

A more likely (to me) assesment is that the Centauri are Watching G'Kar too closely for him to access his offworld accounts.

Also, G'Kar may be suffering from "Swiss Banker Syndrome". It has been Proved that a number of Swiss Banks tried to conceal the fact that they held funds belonging to Jews from before the Holocaust. They knew the money was there and who it belonged to, but claimed ignorance for almost 50 years before anyone was able to pry the information out of them.

Blatent theft from war refugees, concentration camp survivors and heirs who had no real financial or political power to force the truth out of the bankers.

After the Centauri occupation is Over, OTOH, I doubt any banker would want to play games with G'Kar.
It might Annoy him and there is nothing worse than a Cranky Narn.

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Yes, I like cats too.
Shall we exchange Recipes?

Re: In LotR will they show the ship G\'Kar left b5 in?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by drakh:
Wasn't the ship given to Lyta in exchange for her sharing teep DNA with them?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not the pretty little explorer-ship. The telepaths got a few larger ships, I think. The explorer ship was purchased by G'Kar just before he left the station.

Looking at that ship, I don't think it would be of much use for more than two - perhaps three at most - people anyway. It looked quite small.

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"It's animal magnetism. What can I say?"
- G'Kar, A Tragedy of Telepaths