Hands up who loves Carnivàle [now with spoilers] - Page 2

Alluveal · March 5th 05, 19:26

The first season is very much like B5 season 1, in that it moves pretty slow, sets down a LOT of groundwork. Season 2 hits the ground running . . . literally.

Jade Jaguar · March 6th 05, 01:55

Carnivale is the program I most look forward to every week. It moves to an hour later time slot this week. Season 1 was great, and season 2 is even better, with the pace picking up considerably. I haven't heard about season three, but there are just a couple more eps to go in this season, so, I wouldn't expect Ben's confrontation with Brother Justin to come, or at least, end, until a third season. The depth and detail of characterization is amazing. I even have sympathy for Stumpy, probably the lowest guy there, who pimps his wife and daughter, is a liar, and a racist. He is just so pathetic, transparent, and humanly vulnerable, I can't help but sympathize with even him. I think Sophie is going to either be used against Ben, in the Ben/Justin confrontation, or, come to Ben's aid against Justin. I wonder, does Justin's sister see how truly evil he is? If she doesn't, even she could turn on him. Then, there is the old Father, who suffered a stroke, and has seen Justin for the devil he is. He might finally win his struggle to move and or speak, and aid Ben. I think at least one of the three will be pivotal in the final confrontation, perhaps all. Ben's visions include the Trinity nuclear test, which took place in '44, or '45, and the current date in the series is 1934, so, how that will play out has me stumpped. The show is so apocalyptic, but is definitely NOT written for those who believe in the rapture, but even THAT may show up before it is over!

AntonyF · March 6th 05, 11:11

Quote:

I wonder, does Justin's sister see how truly evil he is? If she doesn't, even she could turn on him.

Are you kidding? She burnt down a house full of kids for him! She's bad if not worse, because she keeps shaping him.

Alluveal · March 6th 05, 17:47

Anthony took the words right out of my mouth. Iris ain't no angel. She's probably proud her brother is doing so many evil things.

Jade Jaguar · March 7th 05, 03:24

Yes, Iris IS pretty evil herself, and dedicated to Justin, but I'm not sure she actually realizes that he is possessed by the devil. If she has not realized that, when she does find out, she might actually turn against him. After all, it isn't really her Justin any more. Justin really wanted to help the poor, but the possessed Justin just wants power, for some as yet unspecified evil ends. I'm not saying it's likely, just a possibility.

PsionTen · March 7th 05, 04:12

Tonight's episode was damn good. The series is definitely on a roll. I think someone else raised this point, but it's worth noting again .... they're revealing so much now that you have to wonder if the end of season 2 is the planned end of the series. I certainly hope not, but it certainly looks like all of the plotlines are coming to a head.

Jade Jaguar · March 7th 05, 04:49

MOving quickly, coming to a head, I agree. Perhaps they know there will not be a third season, and are trying to complete things in this season. But I think it is just as likely, perhaps more so, that in the two or three eps remaining, they will build to the confrontation between Ben and Justin, but not complete it, leaving it as a cliff-hanger for next season. If that is the case, I think Ben will have some task to perform, after he defeats Justin. Or, if he dies in the process of defeating Justin, someone else will have to complete his task. I haven't seen tonight's ep yet, because I am at work. I DVRed it, and will watch it tomorrow.

I was pretty sure, for a while, that Ben and Sophie were half siblings, meaning that they had the same father. But now, I'm not so sure, since that would mean they have committed incest. But in this show, I think even that is possible.

AntonyF · March 7th 05, 11:37

Quote:

I was pretty sure, for a while, that Ben and Sophie were half siblings, meaning that they had the same father. But now, I'm not so sure, since that would mean they have committed incest. But in this show, I think even that is possible.

Yes, I think that's the case too. And you say incest... but these things do happen, people find they are related after the fact.

snockit · March 7th 05, 17:32

Quote:

I was pretty sure, for a while, that Ben and Sophie were half siblings, meaning that they had the same father. But now, I'm not so sure, since that would mean they have committed incest. But in this show, I think even that is possible.

Yes, I think that's the case too. And you say incest... but these things do happen, people find they are related after the fact.

I was under the impression that Sophie was the daughter of 'Management' [can't recall the name] .... making her the sister of Justin. [1st season, flash back to a man with a tree tatoo raping her mother, at least that what it looked like]

S.

Jade Jaguar · March 8th 05, 04:00

Snockit, you may be right, but, maybe Scutter has that tatoo too. Remember, Management is Ben's counterpart from the previous generation, and Scutter is Justin's. I don't think we have seen enough to know. But, I'd bet we find out.

From the most recent ep, Lincoln Highway, my conjecture that Sophie, Iris, and Norman, the disabled priest, will have crucial roles to play in the Ben/Justin confrontation, perhaps aiding Ben, seems to be well justified. We found out that "Sophie is the Omega," by way of her dead mom possessing Adrien Barbeau. Norman actually tried to assassinate Justin. Iris, who has shown again that she will kill to protect her brother, told Norman to wait, and she, Iris, would help expose Justin for what he is, when the time is right. Can she be serious? If she isn't, why didn't she just hold a pillow over Norman's face, until he was dead? Given his condition, no one would think anything of it, and she has done far worse, taking greater risks. I love how this series generates so many possibilities.

When I saw Ben find Jonesy, and saw the buzzards circling, I immediately knew they would be dead on the ground soon. I did think we would see them fall from the sky, but I guess that was too difficult, or costly, to accomplish. Now, I'm wondering if Jonesy's throwing skills will play a part in the confrontation.