B5TV.COM. Babylon 5 forums Babylon 5 message for the fans from Claudia Christian Babylon 5

Go Back   B5TV.COM > Babylon 5, Crusade and Rangers > B5.world

View Poll Results: Do You Like Byron?
Yes 7 35.00%
No 13 65.00%
No Opinion 0 0%
Voters: 20. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 13th 08, 15:35   #21
Truth_Seeker
Telepath
 
Truth_Seeker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sofia,Bulgaria
Posts: 500
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by maneth View Post
Let's not forget that the Narns exterminated their telepaths and spent many generations trying to recreate them.
Maneth, didn't the Shadows exterminate the Narn telepaths because they were a threath to their ships during the previous Shadow War?
__________________
"Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield."

Last edited by Truth_Seeker; May 13th 08 at 15:38.
Truth_Seeker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th 08, 16:33   #22
vacantlook
Moderator
 
vacantlook's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Virginia
Posts: 11,892
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by maneth View Post
...The telepaths of other species, what little we have seen of them, don't seem to have this desire to mistreat the non-telepaths of their species, as human ones seem to. So they're not a threat in the same way, and thus get better treatment....
Of course the other side of that circle is that most human telepaths have such a problem with human non-telepaths because of how non-telepaths have treated telepaths. When you're ostracized nearly constantly by the bulk of society, you tend to grow angry at and resentful toward those ostracizing you.

Quote:
...Let's not forget that the Narns exterminated their telepaths and spent many generations trying to recreate them.
The Shadows were the ones behind the drive to eliminate Narn telepaths since Shadows, or at least their technology, was vulnerable to telepathic interference and the Shadows used Narn as a base during the previous war.

Oops, I see TS got to this point first.
vacantlook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th 08, 17:04   #23
Truth_Seeker
Telepath
 
Truth_Seeker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sofia,Bulgaria
Posts: 500
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by maneth View Post
The telepaths of other species, what little we have seen of them, don't seem to have this desire to mistreat the non-telepaths of their species, as human ones seem to. So they're not a threat in the same way, and thus get better treatment. At least the Minbari ones do, because they have a system that's as close to communism (community more important and stronger than a single individual, no matter how important) as one can get while still functioning.
Yes Minbari telepaths according to Delenn are treated very well by their own people.

I think that we don't know much about the way other races treat their telepaths but I think that maybe the Centauri telepaths have some restrictions about places they can go and things they can do like gambling for example.The Centauri like to spy and collect dirt on one another so it could be dangerous for telepaths to be able to scan everyone.
__________________
"Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield."

Last edited by Truth_Seeker; May 13th 08 at 20:37.
Truth_Seeker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th 08, 17:16   #24
RMcD
First One
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 373
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth_Seeker View Post
I think the whole idea of asking for a homeworld for the human telepaths was rediculous.

A ship-doable.A small space station-difficult bot doable.But an entire planet-that's just impossible.If a planet has the right conditions for human life it's probably already inhabited.Even if there's no intelligent life on it the colonization would interfere with the natural evolution of this planet which is at least immoral.
I believe the Markab homeworld was recently vacated..

Besides, we saw at least two earthlike planets in Crusade with tiny human colonies on them.

Last edited by RMcD; May 13th 08 at 17:18.
RMcD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th 08, 21:55   #25
Chilli
High Treason Prevention Officer
 
Chilli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 7,496
Send a message via ICQ to Chilli Send a message via MSN to Chilli
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Haven't we had this discussion before?

I stick to what I've said from the beginning: Though Byron's cause was just, he was suck a complete idiot in his pursuit of it that no, I do not like him. Not only due to him being annoying

Stupid, mostly, in that his own (justified) anger made him leash out in every direction, when he should have been looking for allies. Delenn and Franklin being two obvious people who could have been very strong allies of his cause, had he handled the situation better.

His treatment of Franklin, more than anything, proved how much he was driven by anger. Making him not only a poor leader, but also a massive hypocrite.

I don't think this makes him a badly written character, as I a lot of these characteristics are quite realistic. It just doesn't make him very enjoyable, for me.

Last edited by Chilli; May 13th 08 at 21:58.
Chilli is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 13th 08, 23:53   #26
Garovorkin
Telepath
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: boston
Posts: 612
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Bryon was not an evil person , Bester was. Bester had no conscience when it came to Non telepaths and one could argue that Byon at first did not either, But he had enough of a conscience to at least do something, Bester would loose no sleep over killing Mundanes.But even here with regard to telepaths Bester was a liittle Hypocritical, Look at the fact that Talis most likely ended up dead, he seem ed to not have much concern for his fate, look at the way he treated Lyta, she agreed to sign over her Body to him when she died in exchange for money she needed. I would image that Bester and company hung on to ever Telepath virus, found a cure to it probably would use it against rogues, and maybe even engineer it to use on mundanes for all we know. Im not singling out Bester Sheridan also is Hypercritical with regard to his own attitude toward Telpaths, its a blind spot with him
Garovorkin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 14th 08, 00:05   #27
Chilli
High Treason Prevention Officer
 
Chilli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 7,496
Send a message via ICQ to Chilli Send a message via MSN to Chilli
Re: Do You Like Byron?

I don't most people disliking Byron claim that he was evil.

Mostly just that he was a twat.
Chilli is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 14th 08, 00:08   #28
Cell
Telepath
 
Cell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Crystal Lake, IL
Posts: 525
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Pretty much and that his own stupidity led to the deaths of many people. In the end he was just as bad as Bester, and just as much of a killer. Bester killed people with his own hands and brain, while Byron killed people because of his idiocy and lack of a brain.
__________________
"When you have reached the end of the road then you can decide whether to go to the left or the right, to fire or to water. If you make those decisions before you have even set foot upon the road it will take you nowhere." - Galen
Cell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 14th 08, 01:09   #29
Jade Jaguar
First One
 
Jade Jaguar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Ann Arbor, Mi, USA
Posts: 9,727
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilli View Post
... when he should have been looking for allies. Delenn and Franklin being two obvious people who could have been very strong allies of his cause, had he handled the situation better.
Obvious to us, yes, but not to Byron. He really knew nothing about them. That was a large part of his problem.

Okay, so I asked Cell, and got no answer, now I will ask everyone, but especially those of you who think Byron was a dick, um..., excuse me, I believe it was "twat," exactly what should Byron have done, to save his people from Psycorps? Okay, he should have approached Delenn, and or Franklin, but he had no way of knowing they would be sympathetic to his cause. What should he have asked of them? What other recourses might he have had?

I strongly disagree with the statement that Byron was as much a killer as Bester, and responsible for his people's deaths. That's no different from saying that the Jewish leaders of the Warsaw Ghetto were as responsible as the Nazis for the deaths of the Jews there. I still don't get this blind hatred for Byron. Most, if not all, of his actions were reasonable, or at least, in the case of the spying and blackmail, more or less a standard practice of many entities on the station.
__________________
"Those who would give up essential liberty
to purchase a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Benjamin Franklin 1775

"I know that the hypnotized never lie... Do ya?"
Pete Townshend 1971

FREE LEONARD PELTIER
Jade Jaguar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 14th 08, 01:58   #30
Chilli
High Treason Prevention Officer
 
Chilli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 7,496
Send a message via ICQ to Chilli Send a message via MSN to Chilli
Re: Do You Like Byron?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jade Jaguar View Post
Obvious to us, yes, but not to Byron. He really knew nothing about them. That was a large part of his problem.
EXACTLY. He did not know a thing about Franklin, so he assumed the worst. It's called "prejudice".

Quote:
Okay, so I asked Cell, and got no answer, now I will ask everyone, but especially those of you who think Byron was a dick, um..., excuse me, I believe it was "twat," exactly what should Byron have done, to save his people from Psycorps? Okay, he should have approached Delenn, and or Franklin, but he had no way of knowing they would be sympathetic to his cause. What should he have asked of them? What other recourses might he have had?
I don't actually think Byron mishandled the psi cops situation - at that point, there were no other options left. He had painted himself in a corner.

Quote:
I strongly disagree with the statement that Byron was as much a killer as Bester, and responsible for his people's deaths. That's no different from saying that the Jewish leaders of the Warsaw Ghetto were as responsible as the Nazis for the deaths of the Jews there. I still don't get this blind hatred for Byron. Most, if not all, of his actions were reasonable, or at least, in the case of the spying and blackmail, more or less a standard practice of many entities on the station.
I agree with you here. Saying that Byron is "just as bad" as Bester is stupid.
Chilli is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 16:51.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2001 - 2008 B5TV.COM