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Old July 28th 07, 23:47   #11
crazyhorse
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

Grammar police should be shot at birth.

Then jumped on
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Old July 29th 07, 11:54   #12
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

Your only saying that because you're grammer suck's
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Old July 29th 07, 13:02   #13
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

I hope that they are deliberate mistakes
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‘It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself.’
Extract from the Declaration of Arbroath, 1320.

"me and other folk were just tryin tae get the boot in and some other guy banjoed him"

John Smeaton 2007

"You know why they're on the Internet don't you? Cos you wouldny speak to them in the fecking pub!" - Billy Connolly
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Old July 29th 07, 16:03   #14
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

Not even I could suck quite that much unintentionally.
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Old July 29th 07, 16:10   #15
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

Great remarks, b4bob and bester. I totally agree with the both of you, so I won't reiterate your comments but will add a few of my own. A couple of months ago, I posted a thread discussing my 'low excitement level' for TLT. Based on what I heard of JMS's intentions for small stories, I just couldn't get excited for it. I felt that I should, B5 being my favorite series of all time, but I never really got jazzed about it.

What JMS always did right in the series was the big picture, long-running arcs and a great 5-year story. I always felt his hand at creating smaller, single episode stories wasn't as strong. Finally having seen TLT, I felt it fit my expectations pretty closely. Both stories are too dialogue driven for their own good, but more importantly TLT again shows JMS (comparative) weakness for a small story.

I found it very odd that in both stories the main characters would discuss things that would become EXTREMELY topical 5 minutes later. In the first story , the priest begins a conversation about dwindling faith because there is no proof of the existence of God. Then 5 minutes later, proof presents itself. In the second, Galen tells Sheridan of the horrible things Vintari will do in 30 years times. 5 minutes later, Vintari himself begins casting some dark omens.

Unless the priest is always prattling on about dwindling faith and Vintari is always hinting at his darker side, this is an incredible coincidence. Now, in a bigger picture, if these events were separated by 5 episodes instead of 5 minutes - it would be riveting. In its current form it's just lazy scripting.

Don't get me wrong - I also liked a lot of what TLT has to offer and hope it sparks a whole season worth of new content. The opening sequence was great, the SFX were top notch, JMS's direction, the performances, well I could go on: all great. But for me, the not-so-great really stood out - which is a first for me with B5. I am even really apologetic of LOTR because I feel al lot of great moments outweigh the clunkers.

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Old July 29th 07, 17:01   #16
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

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Originally Posted by Dangerousapple View Post
Unless the priest is always prattling on about dwindling faith and Vintari is always hinting at his darker side, this is an incredible coincidence. Now, in a bigger picture, if these events were separated by 5 episodes instead of 5 minutes - it would be riveting. In it's current form its just lazy scripting.
Have you ever experienced a short story that *didn't* get right down to the point? Short stories are mainly plot-driven while longer works can be more character-driven. It's simply a necessity of the form, not any kind of 'lazy scripting'.

Jan
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Old July 29th 07, 17:10   #17
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

I have to agree with Dangerousapple on this one. I think the first story would have worked better without the lengthy first discussion between the priest and Lochley. The whole 'decline of religion/need a new incentive to believe' issue is covered sufficiently in the subsequent scenes with Burke. Sometimes less is more.
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Old July 29th 07, 18:35   #18
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

Plus that first convo between Lochley and the priest comes out of nowhere, is way too on-the-nose, and comes off as a bit cheesy. Lochley has just met this person, and is basically asking how his trip was, and he's like, "And now I shall begin my lengthy thoughts about the state of religion in our Universe."

Wha..?
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Old July 29th 07, 19:59   #19
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

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Plus that first convo between Lochley and the priest comes out of nowhere, is way too on-the-nose, and comes off as a bit cheesy. Lochley has just met this person, and is basically asking how his trip was, and he's like, "And now I shall begin my lengthy thoughts about the state of religion in our Universe."

Wha..?
I agree. I also agree with Jan that a short story has to get to the point straight away, but like Bester said:

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The whole 'decline of religion/need a new incentive to believe' issue is covered sufficiently in the subsequent scenes with Burke. Sometimes less is more.
Furthermore, structurally and commercially, I find it a bit odd JMS begins the show with a lengthy discussion about religion in the very first scene. Essentially, TLT is a pilot for further episodes to come. I can't even remember a pilot for a conflict-driven sci-fi/fantasy show that began with a lengthy exchange of thoughts. A few examples: Firefly opened with the battle for Serenity, Deep Space Nine with the Borg attack, Buffy with a vampire attack. And now B5:TLT starts off with a conversation about faith. Odd, and probably unwise.
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Old July 29th 07, 23:42   #20
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Re: B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

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Furthermore, structurally and commercially, I find it a bit odd JMS begins the show with a lengthy discussion about religion in the very first scene.
It isn't really an ordinary pilot in the sense that future installments are going to depend on sales figures, not viewing figures. If someone switches off because they get bored with the opening scenes it doesn't matter, because the copy you are watching has already been paid for. And I still think TLT exists primarily as a thankyou to the B5 cast, and secondarily for the enjoyment of B5's existing fans. It's not really striking out to capture a new audience, there will be other opportunities for that down the line.
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