Comparing TMoS with other projects

It's hard to understand why so much secrecy and so much time to announce a project for a feature film if you compare, let's say, with The Da Vinci Code, for example.
The producers got the director (Ron Howard) many months ago, everybody knew about the project, even in the early stages. Now, they pick up the biggest star of the moment, Tom Hanks, for the main role and already announced the release date for may, 19, 2006.
That´s it. Pure and simple.
I know, many explanations have been made, but this question keeps pounding in my head.
Why so much secrecy and why it's taking so long?

Perhaps because if they don't keep things as secret as possible some idiot from Paramount will find out and try to copy their ideas?

Why so much secrecy and why it's taking so long?

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It's obvious they want to keep it as low profile as possible at this stage. Reason behind this? Maybe some deals needs to be signed (SFX company etc) or they just want to keep it under strict marketing control. Only TPTB knows the right answers.

And one reason why we know so little is that there is little or no pressure for leaks. I quess media intest in B5 is not high enough to reward or sustain leaks.

JMS has been fairly quiet last month so i hope TMoS announcment will come shortly (this month).

I work in the film/television industry and there could be a number of reasons behind the lack of an announcement. Last I heard, many of the original cast haven't even heard anything first-hand, which would suggest to me that things are quite far from concrete from a studio standpoint. Even if the actors had been signed nothing is locked until the movie hits the screens.

My guess, and this is just a guess on my part based on the details that I have heard about the project, is that WB has commissioned JMS to "develop" the script rather extensively with WB closely examining each script draft and both sides exchanging feedback. Until something is announced I would take that to mean that, even if there was initial interest from the studio in the "idea" of a Babylon 5 feature, that nothing to this point has compelled WB to commit beyond the script process.

That doesn't necessarily mean that they don't like the script. There are a lot of departments within studios that usually need to sign off before a project is given the "green light" to go heavy into pre-production and that can take time. Having said that, if six months from now we hear nothing... then there is a problem.

In general, in a project without a big star, director, or producer pulling things along the scrutiny for a project can be great. Remember that X-Men, Spider-Man, the upcoming Superman and the new Battlestar Galactica series were in pre-production limbo for years before getting studio support to go forward. Each of these projects went from script to script without the studios going forward. I would think the same would hold true for B5 since it isn't exactly the most popular franchise in television history so JMS probably isn't going to get the benefit of doubt that a big star or hot director or producer would be afforded.

Honestly, and I've thought about this for awhile, I wouldn't be surprised if TMoS doesn't end up either as a Sci Fi Channel mini-series or TV movie. If you play devil's advocate and try and punch-holes in B5 as a feature... Well, it's not hard to come up with reasons for a studio to be sceptical when, by nature, science fiction films are VERY expensive. Even if you took a standard B5 episode and turned it into a feature, with no additional cast or production values the cost would increase ten-fold at least! Every actor and member of the crew as well as everyone else even remotely associated with the project are going to get paid several times over what they would make on a per episode basis.

I work in the film/television industry and there could be a number of reasons behind the lack of an announcement. Last I heard, many of the original cast haven't even heard anything first-hand, which would suggest to me that things are quite far from concrete from a studio standpoint. Even if the actors had been signed nothing is locked until the movie hits the screens.

My guess, and this is just a guess on my part based on the details that I have heard about the project, is that WB has commissioned JMS to "develop" the script rather extensively with WB closely examining each script draft and both sides exchanging feedback. Until something is announced I would take that to mean that, even if there was initial interest from the studio in the "idea" of a Babylon 5 feature, that nothing to this point has compelled WB to commit beyond the script process.

That doesn't necessarily mean that they don't like the script. There are a lot of departments within studios that usually need to sign off before a project is given the "green light" to go heavy into pre-production and that can take time. Having said that, if six months from now we hear nothing... then there is a problem.

In general, in a project without a big star, director, or producer pulling things along the scrutiny for a project can be great. Remember that X-Men, Spider-Man, the upcoming Superman and the new Battlestar Galactica series were in pre-production limbo for years before getting studio support to go forward. Each of these projects went from script to script without the studios going forward. I would think the same would hold true for B5 since it isn't exactly the most popular franchise in television history so JMS probably isn't going to get the benefit of doubt that a big star or hot director or producer would be afforded.

Honestly, and I've thought about this for awhile, I wouldn't be surprised if TMoS doesn't end up either as a Sci Fi Channel mini-series or TV movie. If you play devil's advocate and try and punch-holes in B5 as a feature... Well, it's not hard to come up with reasons for a studio to be sceptical when, by nature, science fiction films are VERY expensive. Even if you took a standard B5 episode and turned it into a feature, with no additional cast or production values the cost would increase ten-fold at least! Every actor and member of the crew as well as everyone else even remotely associated with the project are going to get paid several times over what they would make on a per episode basis.

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What will most likely be my one post here today, meaning I don't have time and this is the only one that needed posting, will consist of the request to please disregard everything quoted above.

JMS has stated repeatedly that TMoS is a go, read this to mean "greenlit."

They have been and are in negotiations with cast and crew at the moment, please note the PJ statement at the recent con that the film is moving forward and "it might just have a big haired alien in it."

These things do not happen overnight. WB has been very clear (read JMS's posts) that they do NOT want leaks on this.

All is well, and WB and JMS are way past the very early stages JJ mentioned above.

The most logical cause of the delay has been the untimely passing of our beloved Rick Biggs. This caused the project to tailspin briefly while JMS went back to the drawing board to rewrite. JMS has told us this.

There is a production office, which again clearly indicates that they are way past the stage mentioned above by JJ.

You don't have offices in studios in the UK if you haven't gotten the green light yet.

The studio will announce when they're damn ready. Until then no cast or crew, including JMS, can say anything they're not supposed to, and rest assured they all know a lot and cannot say. They can hint and such, but cannot say anything as they are most likely under some form of gag order from WB.

Each production carries its own set of rules, for pre-production, for production, for announcing, for post, for marketing.

TMoS is being handled much more like SF films notoriously are handled. I am by no means worried or surprised by anything going on (or the apparent lack thereof -- PLEASE NOTE I said "apparent" as I'm pretty damn sure that part of the reason we've not heard much from JMS lately is because he's busy as hell).

Having a production office flat out means that they ARE in pre-production. Period.

'Nough said.

CE

On one hand you have a recent best seller that Ron Howard and Tom Hanks want to adapt, on the other hand you have an old cult scifi show with the one-armed man from "The Fugitive" and the guy from "The Scarecrow and Mrs King" possibly attached. Why oh why would one move quicker than the other?

Actually, I would prefer a new series, which could possibly be the way things go if the feature idea falls through (as with the new Battlestar Galactica). I know some (possibly even JMS himself) argue that B5 was only supposed to be 5 seasons and a continuation is somehow a betrayal of this idea, but what stikes me as as odd about this way of thinking is that these same people seem full in support of TMoS. So apparently a feature continuation of the storyline is just fine but a series continuation is unacceptable? Huh?!

And remember, boys and girls, that the original B5 storyline essentially concluded with season 4 as JMS was unsure of a 5th season being a possibility. Basically, season 5 is essentially Babylon 5 the sequel anyway.

One of the things that I find fault in Babylon 5 is that Babylon 5 is advertised as a five year novel for television yet the fifth season plays like a starting point (or a first season) and so much is left open. I enjoy ambiguity but ambiguity should not be confused with unfinished. It's like the original Star Wars films ending after "The Empire Strikes Back" or the Lord Of The Rings books/movies ending after "The Fellowship Of The Rings" - basically with essential plots left on the table. You watch season five and get wrapped up in the plots expecting a payoff as was the case with the preceeding seasons but you get... nothing. Nadda. No payoff. I SAT THROUGH THE TELEPATH SONG ONLY FOR A TEASE!!! A continuation would justify season five and could enhance the whole of the original as well.

Anywho, sequels to science fiction novels are about a popular as Pamela Anderson at a boob touching festival. Is there any popular science fiction novel that does not have a sequel novel? Very few. Lord of the Rings, Dune, Foundation, Lensman, Asimov's Robot novels, 2001, etc all had several sequels. So no big deal, right?

Perhaps TMoS will make it to the big screen (and I assume it will deal with the open plots of season 5) but if a feature doesn't come, I'm hoping for a series.

Off topic here: After B5 concluded, I would have loved to have seen a trilogy of five year series - Now THAT would be ambitious! - but instead we got Crusade (a hybrid Star Trek/Star Blazers rip-off) and Legend Of The Rangers (let's just pass right over this one). With the early momentum from the move to TNT (I know it's blasphemy to some to give anyone that butts heads with JMS any credit) I would have loved to have seen JMS not avoid doing a direct Babylon 5 sequel (from what I've heard he did not want to do a direct Babylon 5 sequel for the, I think, foggy logic reasons stated above).

Instead, Crusade was pushed forth and while only the first episode is, in my opinion, terrible the show is instantly forgetable. TNT, probably quite rightly taking their perspective under consideration and removing pro-B5 bias, was unsure of what it was getting and the whole thing fell apart. TNT didn't mess with B5 season 5, it wasn't until a new series was developed that, like most of the critical reviews that panned Crusade, TNT got cold feet. Taking the whole "TNT wanted to ruin Crusade" conspiracy out of the equation, when the show did air the ratings were not good. With a mediocre show and average at best ratings most networks would have tried to tweak things and would have canceled it all the same.

With all spin-offs one can expect a dewindling audience and B5 had little audience to spare to begin with, but still the ratings for season 5 were not bad. B5 could have continued with a direct sequel and, supposedly, this is what TNT wanted - they wouldn't have commissioned Crusade in the first place if they didn't like B5. A new series could have reintroduced the series for new fans and held on to the faithful, instead the momentum was killed and the relationship to a network that was supportive to the B5 concept (and by the way made the fifth season possible) was severed.

The B5 franchise has been fledgling ever since and until I actually see a new Babylon 5 feature or television project first-hand I will be sceptical that any new project will see light.

On one hand you have a recent best seller that Ron Howard and Tom Hanks want to adapt, on the other hand you have an old cult scifi show with the one-armed man from "The Fugitive" and the guy from "The Scarecrow and Mrs King" possibly attached. Why oh why would one move quicker than the other?

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Don't forget that Babylon 5 has Claudia Christian from "The Substitute 3: Winner Takes All." If you can't sell a studio on that... Then damn Hollywood to Hell!!!

Actually, I would prefer a new series, which could possibly be the way things go if the feature idea falls through (as with the new Battlestar Galactica). I know some (possibly even JMS himself) argue that B5 was only supposed to be 5 seasons and a continuation is somehow a betrayal of this idea, but what stikes me as as odd about this way of thinking is that these same people seem full in support of TMoS. So apparently a feature continuation of the storyline is just fine but a series continuation is unacceptable? Huh?!

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Try 5 years plus 5 films.

Films to pay writer an actors a higher rate.

It just took longer to start the films than JMS planned.

And remember, boys and girls, that the original B5 storyline essentially concluded with season 4 as JMS was unsure of a 5th season being a possibility. Basically, season 5 is essentially Babylon 5 the sequel anyway.

One of the things that I find fault in Babylon 5 is that Babylon 5 is advertised as a five year novel for television yet the fifth season plays like a starting point (or a first season) and so much is left open. I enjoy ambiguity but ambiguity should not be confused with unfinished. It's like the original Star Wars films ending after "The Empire Strikes Back" or the Lord Of The Rings books/movies ending after "The Fellowship Of The Rings" - basically with essential plots left on the table. You watch season five and get wrapped up in the plots expecting a payoff as was the case with the preceeding seasons but you get... nothing. Nadda. No payoff. I SAT THROUGH THE TELEPATH SONG ONLY FOR A TEASE!!! A continuation would justify season five and could enhance the whole of the original as well.

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You call "The Fall of Centauri Prime" nada? I admit the Telepath crisis sort of petered out, but JMS has said time and again that one of his points is there's always more. This isn't a nice good-guys-against-the-evil-overlord plot that can wrap up nicely once justice prevails and the villian has been soundly squashed. If there's a villian in Babylon 5, it's the frailties of the mind -- and as Franklin says, it's gonna take more than a hundred years to breed a (morally/ethically) better human.

So there will always be more battles. There will always be loose ends. The fact that JMS does it well enough that it still all makes dramatic sense makes him a master.

On one hand you have a recent best seller that Ron Howard and Tom Hanks want to adapt, on the other hand you have an old cult scifi show with the one-armed man from "The Fugitive" and the guy from "The Scarecrow and Mrs King" possibly attached. Why oh why would one move quicker than the other?

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You're right on that. At least parcially. It's not a matter of "go quicker". It's that damn secrecy that bothers me.
We all know this long story about "green lights" and actors and crew being cast, delay of the script due to Rick's death, the office in England. I know, you know, everybody knows that(except JJ for his own reasons. Maybe he didn't want to go back to the older posts, but I'm OK with that. ).

JJ mentioned X-Men movies, The Spiderman movies the Galactica mini series and others that got thru this long limbo process, but everybody knew about it. We follow all those stories thru many different sites for months. It wasn't any secret, despite the problems.

In the TMoS case, except for Rick's death, at least aparently there isn't any other big problem.
Why everything involving B5 have this "aura of trouble and dificulty"?

Why the people involved had to sign contracts that says that they can't make any comment about the project?

I don't know. If there's a logical, and I mean VERY logical explanation, it must be beyond my understanding of this universe.

I think from the start JMS saw a difference between the original show 'Bablylon 5' and 'the Babylon 5 Universe'. I think you are failing to consider that.

From early on JMS was hoping to eventually have a feature film to tell the telepath story at least, IIRC.

And even JMS admits that his efforst on "Crusade" were rushed and he was dangerously burnt out by the time he started that series. Personally, I think Crusade had some real hope and would have made a very interesting series if TNT hadn't shifted its programming goals so drastically at that time.

And remember, boys and girls, that the original B5 storyline essentially concluded with season 4 as JMS was unsure of a 5th season being a possibility. Basically, season 5 is essentially Babylon 5 the sequel anyway.

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No, not really.

JMS pushed S4 along faster to get to *a* reasonable stopping point in the likely absense of S5, but he did not push all of his original S4 and S5 story up into S4. By all accounts (if you look back at JMS' quotes on the subject) the original S4 cliffhanger would have been leaving Sheridan in Clarke's custody at the end of Intersections in Real Time. That is only a shift of 4 episodes in the location of the season break.

If you go back and look at his quotes from around the beginning of the series, you'll find JMS talking about the series being about the entire cycle of the war(s): build up, actual fighting, and aftermath. That last item is the part that was contained largely in S5. It was *always* intended to be there.

S5 was not a sequel season. Pushing to have a workable ending after four seasons changed the structure so that S5 felt less connected to the rest of the series than it would have otherwise. It did not force him to come up with a "sequel season".

To add on to what Hyp said, JMS has always also said regarding the Theatrical film that he didn't want to compete with Star Wars Prequels. So, it would surprise me at all, if major information, isn't held close to the vest until June. We also don't know if Tim Choate's passing may have caused some rewrites and upheaval.

B5 the Series Proper was a self contained story. Season 5, was not "add on". Season 5' start, should have been more properly and smoothly blended into the ending of Season 4, but most of what we saw in Season 5 is not filler, it always intended to be there. It simply would've started unfolding a few episodes before Season 4 ended, and Season 4 end, might have stretched into a couple episodes of Season 5. The movies, Crusade, Rangers, and anything else are expansions of B5, the Series proper, IMHO.

Why so much secrecy and why it's taking so long?

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B5 is more "underground" series than, for example, Star Trek. The marketing and announcement has to be done correctly, or otherwise everyone will forget the whole TMoS. IMO. Then there is this "draw a card from deck and instantly apply its effect on project" -variable. B5 is not the first priority of WB, it has never been. And of course there's the "money talks and bullshit walks" -variable also in this project... Well, I think you got my point. My dear good friend.