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B5:TLT - Show Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

It seemed very much like the start of Vintari's story, and the story has left me wanting to see more of it.

Vintari living on Minbar with Sheridan and family could lead to Vintari and David becoming close friends. Young Dictator guy and Guy with a Drakh Keeper, there's a lot of potential there.

In any case, the b5 universe at present has too many unresolved cliffhangers - (if expanded upon) Vintaris story better tie in to one of the loose ends.
 
Vintari living on Minbar with Sheridan and family could lead to Vintari and David becoming close friends. Young Dictator guy and Guy with a Drakh Keeper, there's a lot of potential there.

In any case, the b5 universe at present has too many unresolved cliffhangers - (if expanded upon) Vintaris story better tie in to one of the loose ends.
Well, JMS did say we would see David in the next disc at NYCC. And the way Sheridan explained to Vintari how he would live with them, it does seem they could have those two characters together.

And while there are some big unresolved events, or events we know happen but not exactly how or why, in terms of character arcs, a lot of the characters have more or less already gone through a complete one. I like the introduction of a character that basically is at the start of his journey here. Like I said, I wouldn't mind seeing more of it.
 
I thought the Vorlons posed as celestial beings to make people react more favourably to them. Now it seems that they did just that, POSE. If that's the case, wouldn't GOD be a little miffed that there's a whole race of beings out there running around pretending to be angels?

God's existence has no more definitively been established now than it ever has. And even if God did exist and was pissed at the Vorlons, would he be any more pissed at them pretending to be angels than he/she/it would be pissed over humans walking around pretending to speak for God.

Well said!

Keep :)
 
Something I'm not sure on but has been mentioned here is the Centari capability to commit war.

Now as I understand it the centuari fleet was sent away by the Prince Regent before the Alliance attacked.Massive destruction to homeworld but fleet left intact.

Not to mention that a new race in the cosmos seemed to recover in ten years from being on the brink of destruction.

Is it just me or does the EA seem liked they jumped too far ahead from being a weaker race to dominating?Oh wow we build communities,WTF is every city and Goverment from the other races then?

As for the God thing,you see what you want to see ;)
 
Something I'm not sure on but has been mentioned here is the Centari capability to commit war.

Now as I understand it the centuari fleet was sent away by the Prince Regent before the Alliance attacked.Massive destruction to homeworld but fleet left intact.

Not to mention that a new race in the cosmos seemed to recover in ten years from being on the brink of destruction.

Is it just me or does the EA seem liked they jumped too far ahead from being a weaker race to dominating?Oh wow we build communities,WTF is every city and Goverment from the other races then?

The Centauri's capability to commit war has indeed been talked about; just flip three or two pages back and you will see the discussion. Cliff Notes version: Galen took Sheridan to the year 2301 at this point the Centauri fleet has been building for the past 39 since 2262. If you have read the Centauri trilogy you find out that due to influences by the Drakh between 2262 to 2278 the Drakh have grown the Centauri fleet massively for the purposes of attacking the Alliance also the Drakh provided technology to the Centauri. So far we have been given no reason why in between 2278 and 2301 that fleet has dwindled in size.

The bit about communities is that yes every other race does have communities, but only humans (in the B5 universe) are able to create a community that includes both humans and aliens. To get more into it you would need to watch the Babylon 5 series.
 
Watching a episode from the dreaded series five made me think of this again.Secrets of the Soul.

The Drazi had Interstellar travel while we were in the middle ages and are warlike,driven by profit and not exactly what you would call moral in there treatment of other races.

How did we not only catch up but overtake them?
 
Even saying a commie/capilitist ideaolgy would hinder a races advancement does nothing but make an excuse for one race,not the rest of them ;)

So was technology growth stunted by the First Ones?

Even the amount of ships the other races have seem to not make make sense.The Shadows destroy a fleet comparable to what was sent to B5 by EF and the Narn Homeworld is left defenceless.

Where were the Minbari Cruisers when B5 was surronded by Shadow vessels during the season three finale?

Were they having a picnic?

Never mind the we'll wait for them to fire first bullshit.
 
Being a B5 fan and looking forward to the release of this DVD, I obviously had a huge amount of anticipation as the release day drew nearer.


Then on the 31st the bombshell comes.

No Australia encoded release!

WTF...

Come on.


But thankfully I am a resourceful fellow and have been able to acquire a copy that works in region 4 DVD players.



Anyway onto the tale... so to speak.

I may shock when I say I found the first story somewhat better than the second, simply for the fact it was the flip side of the coin.

It was the absolute that states "there is no room judgement, for that is the Lords work".


For me it goes to show a lot towards JMS and his journalist teachings about bringing both sides of a story to the table.
Also being a very deeply thought man he would realise that what we think can be, sometimes has absolutely no bearing on what is.


So this episode to me shows his belief in showing people the whole picture. Not just the parts he and others find comfortable.


Oh and yes, the heavy dialog. Loved it! Let me say again. Loved it.
So rich and so full of real hard hitting questions.
I found the character of Asmodeus to be exceptional. There were times when I believed him to be possessed.
Thanks in part to the actors ability to do a pretty good Hannibal Lector voice and his ability to delivery those lines with a sense of true elevated "evil" if I can use the term.

The way it drew pleasure from tormenting those around it and trying to make them feel they themselves had been forsaken, coupled with the real sense that this thing cared nothing for the worldly power symbols that are usually sort, made the character believable.

And of cause some cool special effects.



The second episode, for me, seemed to be more of a lead-in than a standalone story such as the first.

Some good CGI and the hint of a very cool battle scene.
Some good dialogue and some heartfelt moments. The goodbye to G'Kar and Steven.

The very real response from Bruce, not John, when asked what it was like coming back to B5 after ten years.

The episode seems to be more geared towards the story of, if I remember correctly, of how this prince helps save David from the control of the keeper. Correct me if I am wrong.

Also towards what you may one day see, a battle between the Centauri Empire and the Earth Alliance.
I would not be surprised if the Captain came riding in on wings of fire for that!


Basically I see it two ways.

One.
John and Delen get through to this kid and no war. Somewhere along the way he frees David from the keeper.

Two.
The prince frees David is on the path to salvation and is somehow driven back to his dreams of raining fire on cities.
Not too farfetched given Londo's tragic spiral into such events. Also given that this kid’s dad thought himself a god. Gives you some idea to the possibilities that this kid is just too unstable and will eventually go this way as well.


I am going to leave QS (quantum space) alone.
It will either be a joke for that episode, just so JMS could stick it to the press.
Or he will justify it with that old Vorlon adage of never forgetting that which you already know.
Meaning, it was already there, it’s just they didn't tell anyone.


Just my view.
 
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Anyone have any sales figures yet? How is it selling?
I've been looking actually, but haven't really found anything. The two big retail trackers are Rentrak's Retail Essentials and Nielsen's VideoScan. Both require a hefty sum to get access to the data, but at least VideoScan's numbers show up in some of the public charts, like billboard.com. However, I don't think TLT sold quite that well to show up in those public charts, and you still need to pay money if you want to see the larger versions of those charts that TLT might be on.

The-numbers.com is a website that offers public boxoffice tracking, and they happen to have started providing slightly longer charts for dvd sales two weeks ago. The chart for the week TLT was published in isn't up yet, but should be somewhere today I think.

edit: OK, the numbers chart I mentioned has just updated, and no TLT on that either. So the only thing we can really say I think is that it probably sold under under 20.000 units.
 
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I may shock when I say I found the first story somewhat better than the second, simply for the fact it was the flip side of the coin.
You seem to be correct. I enjoyed it, because it does raise some interesting questions.
The episode seems to be more geared towards the story of, if I remember correctly, of how this prince helps save David from the control of the keeper. Correct me if I am wrong.
Prince Vintari is an entirely new character. From what we know in the Centauri trilogy the Prince plays no part in David's rescue from Centauri Prime. In fact he doesn't appear in the books. However, the trilogies are only as cannon as the outline by jms. Therefore, if jms decides to write a screenplay that disagrees with how a particular event happed in the trilogies then jms screenplay wins. So, as of this moment Vintari doesn't play a part in David's rescue but maybe if Sheridan and Delenn can change Vintari's perspective for the better who knows. Yet, maybe Vintari has a falling out with Sheridan and Delenn later on but before 2278.
 
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The Centauri Trilogy doesn't actually give any details on how David was freed from his Keeper right? All we really know is that David took off on his own and went to Centauri Prime, Sheridan and Delenn followed him, and somewhere along the line David was freed. So, really JMS can write just about anything in the details without de-canonizing what is written in the Centauri Trilogy. Considering Vintari's afinity for Alien Tech, you never know (Certainly seems Centauri Tech alone wouldn't be enough, although I always assumed the technomages freed David...or was that actually written?)
 
The Centauri Trilogy doesn't actually give any details on how David was freed from his Keeper right?

Wrong, and it's extremely satisfying. :D


All we really know is that David took off on his own and went to Centauri Prime, Sheridan and Delenn followed him, and somewhere along the line David was freed. So, really JMS can write just about anything in the details without de-canonizing what is written in the Centauri Trilogy.


Wrong. That's partially incorrect, and that's not all we know.



Considering Vintari's afinity for Alien Tech, you never know (Certainly seems Centauri Tech alone wouldn't be enough, although I always assumed the technomages freed David...or was that actually written?)

You need to read the books.

Spoiler for Legions of Fire Book III: How David is freed....
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Don't read below if you don't want to be spoiled.
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Hey, I mean it!
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Spoiler for Legions of Fire Book III: How David is freed....:
Michael Garibaldi and Vir kill Shiv'kala, the Drakh who spawned David's keeper, and it's a wonderful scene. When the Drakh who spawned the keeper dies, so does the keeper. It just dies and falls off, without harming the one to whom the keeper was attached. Therefore, anybody could have freed Londo by killing Shiv'kala, since he also spawned Londo's keeper. If only anybody had known..... :(
 
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Spoiler for :
I have read the Trilogy, and I remember that act, but, had forgotten that act freed David, thanks for the correction.
 
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If only Spoiler Code worked here. <sigh>

Spoiler code does work here; you just left a little something out: an equals sign.

The code this board uses is:

[ spoiler= ] text [ /spoiler ] (with out the spaces, of course)

Generally speaking, after the = you put whatever it is that the spoiler is for. For example:

[ spoiler=The identity of the best science fiction show of all time ] Babylon 5 [ /spoiler ]

Spoiler for The identity of the best science fiction show of all time:
Babylon 5


You don't have to include anything after the equals sign, but you do have to include the equals sign.

Spoiler for :
I hope this helps.
 

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