Galactica Season 4 (Spoilers Within)

Totally off the wall idea.

If some of the Cylon skin jobs can grow old possibly they can grow up.
They could have been infiltrated as a new born babies. That way they have a full set of paper work and people that can remember them.

That would work, and even make sense, for the young ones. Not really for Tigh, though, with the timing we've been given.

A_M_Swallow said:

Totally off the wall idea.

If some of the Cylon skin jobs can grow old possibly they can grow up.
They could have been infiltrated as a new born babies. That way they have a full set of paper work and people that can remember them.

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I'll see your baby Cylons and raise you... Cylon fetuses! Cylon embryos! Implanted in human women. By Dr Black Cylon guy.

Yeah, that's the stuff.

http://www.lilformers.com/index.php/2009/02/09/lil-formers-134-battlestar-galactica/

Dr Frankenstein + Terminator + Alexis from "Dynasty" = Ellen Tigh

Maybe it was just my mood tonight, but I didn't feel all that interested in this episode. The only thing that truly did interest me was the very end when Adama and Roslin saw the cylon putting up a picture on the wall.

And did I see correctly with the previews for next week that there are only four episodes left?

vacantlook said:

Maybe it was just my mood tonight, but I didn't feel all that interested in this episode. The only thing that truly did interest me was the very end when Adama and Roslin saw the cylon putting up a picture on the wall.

And did I see correctly with the previews for next week that there are only four episodes left?

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I'm not going to presume anything for your pov per say but my guess is that fans will complain that:

1) Nothing new about the backstory/mythology was revealed, which normally would be ok, but after the wallop of last week, we probably expected some further clarification and elaboration.
2) Most of the episode was Ellen Tigh being the old Ellen Tigh PLUS all cylony, so extra Ellen. Most fans at least I know found her annoying, but she's come to be my favorite actress on the show.

And yes, 4 episodes. Also, preview for next week implied we'll find out about Starbuck's deal.

Yeah, the episode felt a bit drab to me. I was pissed that Caprica 6's baby died. I knew that would happen the moment she became pregnant and it felt like one big let-down.

Boomer coming back interests me, but having this big execution thing with her does not interest me. Amnesty was given to everyone. Apparently, they forget who it applies to.

I love the actress that plays Ellen, but her returning to her old "Ellen ways" annoyed the frack out of me. She's supposed to be this evolved being, this woman who was partially responsible for building cylons and she's turned into some petty, manipulative wench. I don't know. It seems like a character flaw in a sense.

My guess is that the group leaving will take Baltar's crew with them to have some human mix in there.

Where they go, who knows.

Kobol seems the only place that will support life (that and New Caprica--ugh.)

I was pissed that Caprica 6's baby died. I knew that would happen the moment she became pregnant and it felt like one big let-down.

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How can something you expected be a let-down?

Yes, I know you want to smack me, but you can't do that over the internet, ha ha.

I love the actress that plays Ellen, but her returning to her old "Ellen ways" annoyed the frack out of me. She's supposed to be this evolved being, this woman who was partially responsible for building cylons and she's turned into some petty, manipulative wench. I don't know. It seems like a character flaw in a sense.

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Kind of makes you sympathize w/ Cavil's position. I think that's kind of the point- that Cylons are mentally and emotionally no different than humans. Now the idea of a being as supposedly brilliant as Ellen but so averagely flawed emotionally could have been quite the wonderful character study, if done in a better way. But you're right- at this point, it's hard to see her as some sort of genius.

My guess is that the group leaving will take Baltar's crew with them to have some human mix in there.

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But weren't they leaving for the purpose of being "pure" Cylon in the 1st place? Or does the death of the Cylon fetus change all that?

As for going to Kobol- did they ever say on this show why the human fleet doesn't just settle there?

Alluveal said:

I love the actress that plays Ellen, but her returning to her old "Ellen ways" annoyed the frack out of me. She's supposed to be this evolved being, this woman who was partially responsible for building Cylons and she's turned into some petty, manipulative wench. I don't know. It seems like a character flaw in a sense.

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No. She isn't. And that was the point of last night's episode. The Final Five aren't these super evolved Cylons. They aren't Gods. They are Five Cylon individuals who just happened to be smart enough to re-invent resurrection technology just in time to have themselves be saved by it, and escaped back to the Colonies. That's it. They are engineers. Scientists, perhaps. But with their own problems and flaws. They are just "people" for lack of a better word. Even Tigh said that they had to "invent" a God for the models they created, because they couldn't have their new creations deifying them. They certainly aren't worthy of it, they just happened to be the ones who survived, that's all.

GKarsEye said:

As for going to Kobol- did they ever say on this show why the human fleet doesn't just settle there?

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At the time, wasn't it because the Cylons were right on their heels and they needed to stay on the run? Aside from that, probably no reason at all.

Wow, triple post from me. That's never happened before.

Anyway, one thing that DIDN'T work for me at all in that episode was the Chief. What's up with him all of a sudden voting to leave the fleet? That seems way out of character for him. He has been in the same camp as Sol regarding "you are who you choose to be" the entire time. He has tried to remain the most human. He risked everything during the coup to save Adama and the Galactica crew. Then he fins the ship being damaged is is trying to fix her the only way he thinks it can be done.

Then...out of left field..."I vote to leave"

WTF?!?!?! I guess they just needed that extra vote to make some drama in the "deadlock" of the vote (title of the episode) so they decided they needed him to vote to leave. I thought that was pretty weak and out of character.

I totally agree re:Tyrol. It made no sense for him to out of no where vote to leave. He was all about being the chief again last week, and this week he doesn't give a frak? It smacks of totally being a constructed needed to push the "deadlock" theme and not something that fits the character. Definitely some unthought-out writing there.

Haven't seen this episode yet, but I think the Chief isn't in one camp or the other...and that's the point. He's swinging like a pendulum every time he's faced with a convincing argument.


Look at him a few weeks back before the coup and he's all "we" with the cylons and "you" with the colonials", then when Adama talks to him about being the Chief he's all for it. So in some ways his duality doesn't surprise me.

One other reason for not resettling on Kobol is superstition reinforced by recent events.It is said that no human can set foot on Kobol without their being a price to pay in blood.And while many may consider it superstitious belief, a great many might equally see the deaths that occured during the fleet's last visit to be sufficient evidence.

Besides, it simply isn't safe to go anywhere known, until the threat of Cavil's faction is removed ort neutralised.

Ooh, me 3 about Tyrol! Don't know what's up w/ that guy....

One thing I did catch in this episode, and maybe it was stated clearly before, but if so I missed it.

So apparently Earth was a 100% Cylon skinjob planet initially? For some reason I was under the impression there were humand and Cylons on Earth, and that the difference was that the Humans there wiped out the Cylons (opposite of the Colonies). But yesterday's episode sure implied that Earth was all Cylon skinjobs?

That's what I got from Sol's comment about Earthing being "pure Cylon and it didn't work." So humans and Cylons lived on Kobol? Maybe those original living on Kobol humans made the original Cylon skinjob there? You have to assume that ALL of the Skinjob Cylons left for the 13th planet...Earth, while ALL the humans went to the 12 colonies (they went their seperate ways). Then the Cylon skinjobs on Earth make "Centurians" and the Centurians get pissed off and start off a Nuke war....everyone wiped out except the five escapees. They run back to the colonies to tell the humans that if they start (over again) making Centurians and AI to treat them well, and we know the rest.

Still lots of murk....like if the humans on Kobol made the original skinjobs that went to Earth, why would they have to take a "step back" and create Centurians again when they had all this more advanced technology before?

But at least I think I feel better about what happened on Earth from what we were told....

Recoil said:

One thing I did catch in this episode, and maybe it was stated clearly before, but if so I missed it.

So apparently Earth was a 100% Cylon skinjob planet initially? For some reason I was under the impression there were humand and Cylons on Earth, and that the difference was that the Humans there wiped out the Cylons (opposite of the Colonies). But yesterday's episode sure implied that Earth was all Cylon skinjobs?

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They learned that Earth was populated with all cylons when they first arrived at Earth. It was in the first episode shown when the show came back from its ass-long hiatus. They tested every decayed body they found and they were all skeletons of cylons (with the exception of the body Starbuck found, which she burned without telling anyone of her finding it). D'Anna said that every cylon detachment that they had sent around the entire planet, not just the group of main characters that we saw the perspective of in the episode, had also found the same thing.

Still lots of murk....like if the humans on Kobol made the original skinjobs that went to Earth, why would they have to take a "step back" and create Centurians again when they had all this more advanced technology before?

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Either the humans that set out to form the Twelve Colonies didn't take the technology with them, or maybe the human-model technology was developed on Kobol only after the founders of the Twelve Colonies left or something. I do remember that Kobol was the site of a planet-wide disaster like Earth was. When they went down on Kobol at the end of season one/beginning of season two, they found a bunch of skulls piled up all over the place. What I can't remember was if the founders of the Twelve Colonies and those that traveled to Earth left Kobol because they were just stretching out into the rest of the galaxy or if they left because they were trying to escape the warring that produced the skulls all over the ground.

per say

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AARGH! Stop that!

It's per se. It's Latin. "Se" being the Latin reflexive pronoun, "per" being a Latin preposition meaning "by" or "through", making the meaning of the compound Latin phrase being "by itself". Which, unlike "per say", actually means something, and does not make Chilli cry.

End shoebox detour.

Recoil said:

So apparently Earth was a 100% Cylon skinjob planet initially? For some reason I was under the impression there were humand and Cylons on Earth, and that the difference was that the Humans there wiped out the Cylons (opposite of the Colonies). But yesterday's episode sure implied that Earth was all Cylon skinjobs?

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OK, I'm - both on Lost and on BSG - having some problems with the overall plot .. in that I've got questions I'd like to see answered for anything to make sense that seem so simplisitic and stupid I barely want to ask them.

OK. Earth is all Cylon. Cylons arrived in spaceships, left in spaceships.

So where do we guys come in? People actually living on planet earth now? Are we all cylons, or simply un-canon? If the latter is the case, it'd make the whole "Earth" thing pretty gimmicky.

Yeah, it answered the question about Earth being all cylon.

First 5 skinjobs were created on Kobol. They took the centurions and left for Earth. Found a way to procreate and populated the Earth. Then big badda boom. The five had means to resurrect (after rediscovering resurrection.) Not sure how that worked. The 5 go to Earth. They apparently populated the planet by creating more skinjobs or procreation, right? Earth cylons grew in huge numbers, yet how did the "five" manage to maintain their original identities? They didn't live 2000 something years, right? They had to either be resurrected or perhaps reincarnated. Not sure. That's still a big ole question mark.

Mankind left Kobol to find new planets to colonize. That leads me to believe if they found 12 friggin' planets that can support life, they can find a few more out there in the vastness of space.

Mankind (now on the 12 colonies) started to dabble in AI again (may see this in the new Caprica series,) and recreated the cylons. Perhaps forbidden knowledge that someone kept all that time and started tinkering with again. Created centurions. Centurions rebelled and left. Tried to make skinjobs, couldn't. By then the "five" found them and gave them the technology (along with resurrection technology that they rediscovered on Earth.) Created the 8.

That's how I'm seeing it.

Oh, yeah and Tyrol was definitely a WTF moment. Very against character. Sometimes, I wondering if these writers even know their own characters sometimes.

And Bill Adama constantly getting drunk is getting way old. It's sloppy.

The Great Galactica Timeline

Mankind lives on Kobol. It's a happy time, a good time.

Mankind creates Cylons. Skinjobs are created. They are created by humans.

Q: Were Centurions also created here, or was it the skinjobs that rebelled?

Big war. Things blow up. Skinjobs leave to find a "homeworld of their own." Earth is this homeworld.

Humans leave and settle the 12 colonies.

Skinjobs on Earth populate the planet. They can procreate.

Skinjobs create Centurions.

Final Five also receive warnings: Tori sees a man / Anders a woman (warning them about the destruction to come.)

Final Five rediscover resurrection technology. (I put this after the warnings because it makes sense to me that they would start to panic and go searching for means of immortality.) They are urgent about this (due to warnings?)

Centurions rebel against skinjobs on Earth. Huge war. Cylon against cylon (skinjob against centurion)

"Final Five" (skinjobs) resurrect in a ship orbiting Earth thanks to their re-inventing resurrection. They head out to find the humans who have settled the 12 colonies in hopes of telling them, "be kind to your AI."

Queston: Did the Final Five return to Kobol to leave clues? The Temple of Athena? Or was it just the algae planet?

12 Colony starts to tinker with AI again. The cylons are created (centurions) to make life easier on the 12 colonies.

Centurions rebel against humans. Big war.

Centurions leave to find a homeworld of their own.

The Final Five catch up with the cylons. (The question here is, did they come during the war and convince the centurions to cease their hostilities? Or after?)

The Final Five give the centurions the technology to create skinjobs and also gives them resurrection technology. Centurions promote the "One True God" and program it within the skinjobs in hopes that it will soothe the savage beast within.

Cavil rebels. Corrupts model 7's amniotic fluid. Boxes the Five, then resurrects them sans memories and places them amongst the humans. Whether or not this is from birth (and they were babies) or as full grown models is uncertain.

Cavil convinces the other models to attack the humans. To get revenge.

Second cylon war. The 12 colonies are decimated.

Mankind flees. Cylons pursue.

And we are where we are.

Just trying to keep a solid timeline up. Sorry if it's repetitious.