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Old March 23rd 15, 16:36   #29
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 91
Re: EpDis: Divided Loyalties

I went back and watched this episode after the War Without End discussion as its the other most obvious "switching of plans" and personally I'm still a bit "divided" .

What we did get was certainly very enjoyable but to me felt slightly rushed and could perhaps have been better covered by two episodes. You could I spose argue JMS might have been less well disposed to Talia with Andrea Thompson leaving for caeer reasons rather than suffering from the mental health issues Micheal O'Hare had and wanted to get her out of the way more. My guess though would be he just ended up not having the space as when you look at it the end of season 2 is pretty much all essential episodes, even Confessions and Lamentation whilst not a big arc episode was IMHO important to have at that point to set the tone for what follows essentially "upping the stakes".

Beyond Talia herself not getting a great deal of focus in what was her sendoff I felt the whole issue of essentially killing someone by causing there personality to be erased wasnt really covered as much as it could have been. Beyond the moral issue of doing it to unsuspecting crew members I felt it could have been mined quite effectively for drama from the lead characters as well. I spose you could argue even for B5 the "if its me what then?" answer would be a bit dark given that the obvious answer from Ivanova especially would be "throw me out the nearest airlock".

Originally Posted by Lennier's Tears
As for the Talia/Ivanova relationship, was that always going to be part of the story, or did it get added in when Talia got written out of the story, to add to the "Ivanova's failed relationships" background? It sets her up way better for the Marcus story and everything that was to come after that than the old boyfriend thing in the first season (speaking of which, I kinda have to question her judgement if she didn't she that coming. Surely he didn't turn into an alien-hater overnight?). The Talia thing is way more tragic.
Talia being the mole was as I understand it always planned just pushed forward in the story, Not sure whether that means the Ivanova relationship was always planned as well or whether JMS felt it was a good way to use the character.

It is a bit strange looking back now given how much more liberal US TV has become but having openly gay/bisexual characters in a more obvious and prolonged relationship would likely have put JMS under a lot of pressure. Trek bypassed it a little with the Dax episode being essentially a continued hetrosexual relationship and a one off. The big issue with sci fi as well is that you really have to give some comment simply by having to invent how your future society views it at the time.

As I said above I can't help but think even with Thompson leaving at that stage things would have been better spilt up as a two partner. Have the two of them hook up in the first episode and then Lyta turn up(maybe with a bit more drama having to escape pursuit and/or be resuced) and leave the reveal of the mole plot as a cliff hanger to be delt with in the second.

Last edited by Mororless; March 23rd 15 at 16:38.
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