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-   -   EpDis: In The Beginning (http://www.b5tv.com/showthread.php?t=9823)

Babylon5fan07 April 12th 07 09:44

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vacantlook (Post 294325)
I'm not sure you understand my opinion. I'm not saying that Sinclair should have stayed around; I'm not saying that Sheridan should never have come into the picture. I'm saying watching "In The Beginning" before the series itself deprives one of experiencing the apprehension of Sheridan's taking over because one then already knows Sheridan from having watched ITB. Like Garibaldi in the story, one shouldn't feel all that comfortable with Sheridan at first. One's trust in him has to be built through exposure as one watches him more and more, but to already know him from having watched ITB prevents one from having that experience.

No don't worry I understand what your saying but as I've stated in a couple other threads on this board. The very first B5 I showed my ex-girlfriend was The Gathering then of course season 1. My ex got very very confused and thought the show was very confusing. But then when I went to midwinter.com/lurk website which has a somewhat master list of all the episodes and movies in order in which the show should be watched I began marathoning all the B5 episodes on my own and then watching them again with my ex she absolutely loved it. The horrific experience of watching Santiago assassinated really moved my ex a lot. Watching the slow build up of Londo and his slow demise collaborating with Morden and the shadows really made a difference.

Please don't think I don't understand what your saying it's just that my ex ended up asking me to watch the episodes more than I asked her as the series went on. For me its more of a build up one episode at a time kind of thing.

I absolutely love the fact that JMS ended up using a jigsaw puzzle scenario type of writing where you had to fit the episodes together to make a complete picture. I guess this kind of a show is one of those where different people have different takes on how to watch the show. I guess it just depends on what kind of tastes you like. There are even people that won't even give this show a chance because it's either too slow or that it was kind of controversial being toe to toe with Star Trek: Deep Space Nine

Alex

torkste April 18th 07 07:54

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
I votet F for Failure.

To me this was downright stupid, and the worst part of B5, ever.

The future parts with Londo, the two kids and the woman, who we learned in the Centauri trilogy is named Senna, was very nicely done.

The parts were the main "heroes" that had absolutely not met each other before, suddenly, in order to make a new pilot, was revealed to have met before. And not just in passing, no, no, Sheridan meeting the Delenn onboard a Minbari ship and saving the day and so on.
None of this was believable at all.
The worst was the G'Kar bit. Before In The Beginning was made, we had this character going from bad to not so bad and then to a sort of nice guy and savior.
Now suddenly, he was not so bad before he was bad !

Babylon5fan07 April 18th 07 08:56

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by torkste (Post 294933)
I votet F for Failure.

To me this was downright stupid, and the worst part of B5, ever.

The future parts with Londo, the two kids and the woman, who we learned in the Centauri trilogy is named Senna, was very nicely done.

The parts were the main "heroes" that had absolutely not met each other before, suddenly, in order to make a new pilot, was revealed to have met before. And not just in passing, no, no, Sheridan meeting the Delenn onboard a Minbari ship and saving the day and so on.
None of this was believable at all.
The worst was the G'Kar bit. Before In The Beginning was made, we had this character going from bad to not so bad and then to a sort of nice guy and savior.
Now suddenly, he was not so bad before he was bad !

Holy Toledo? Are you serious? I think JMS would be shocked to hear you say that..Not that you can't have an opinion of course but wow..JMS wanted to initially show this movie before The Gathering if you go to midwinter.com/lurker and it explains all the small references of the Earth/Minbari War throughout the 5 year saga including during the 4th season Deleen has to take a test which shows the footage of what happened to Dukhat. It even has a small snippet of what happened to Sheridan/Delenn and if you watch it before the seasons it has a foreshadow of Londo being old on the throne which leads to War Without End and of course the Centauri Trilogy explains all that to a T.

Is this movie as good as Sleeping in Light being the last episode no but it's still the best movie of all the movies.

Wow an A+ movie for me

Alex

Jade Jaguar April 18th 07 09:06

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by torkste (Post 294933)
The worst was the G'Kar bit. Before In The Beginning was made, we had this character going from bad to not so bad and then to a sort of nice guy and savior.
Now suddenly, he was not so bad before he was bad !

I couldn't disagree more. IMO, G'Kar was never bad. He was defensive, abrasive, and indignant. Those qualities may not be endearing to many, but they are quite understandable, and to be expected, from someone whose people had been as brutally oppressed as the Narns were by the Centauri. He had very good reasons for his positions.

Of course, he did move toward a more transcendent view of things, becoming what I would call enlightened. But, I don't think one is a bad person, just because they haven't been "enlightened."

Babylon5fan07 April 18th 07 09:16

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Yes Jade Jaguar I agree..if you watch all 5 seasons of Babylon 5 you notice that Londo and G'Kar have flipped sides when it comes to their personalities. Londo was a fun (funny) kind of a easy man to get along with while G'Kar was being very stern, agressive but still at points funny too but of course as we saw in Midnight on the Firing Line he totally flips out on Londo because of the Ragesh 3 incident but later on as Londo gets asked What Do You Want? from Morden from that point on both end up switching sides..Londo is afraid and continues to make mistakes and isn't even easy to get along with at all while G'Kar becomes very dignified as much as Andreas was himself as an actor plus very easy to get along with.

Alex

Elipsis February 20th 08 16:21

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
A-.

There were some epic B5 historical moments which were only hinted at played out in full in this movie. The Ivanova earring thing was very clever, and it's nice to see our Vorlons together without killing each other. There is a good bit of irony here (Sheridan talking about going up against his own government and how terrible it would be)... but I can't fully get past the large number of coincidences:

Everybody knew everybody else 10 years prior... or at least were in the same area without meeting. (Londo and G'kar / Sheridan and Delenn). It didn't hurt the overall story, but it was a large pill to swallow.

It also could've used another 30 minutes and some original Sinclair footage, nonetheless the overall story is so epic and dramatically presented that all of these minor complaints only take it from an A+ to an A- in my book.

Galahad February 20th 08 19:03

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by torkste (Post 294933)
The worst was the G'Kar bit. Before In The Beginning was made, we had this character going from bad to not so bad and then to a sort of nice guy and saviour.
Now suddenly, he was not so bad before he was bad !

The difference between G'Kar ItB and G'kar S1, is that he isn't playing to a crowd. He'splaying the part of a negotiator... trying to strengthen relations with Earth in order to weaken the human's stronger ties to the Centauri. Whether he is good or bad is irrelevent, he is on his best behaviour because he needs to paint the Narns as good and chip away at the accepted perception of the Centauri subtly.

By the time we are in season 1, G'Kar has a very public stage and uses it to good effect, especially in the B5 Council chambers... and don't forget he is face to face with the representative of the race that antagonized the Narns in the distant past. Passions are bound to run high.

Clark Kent February 23rd 08 20:31

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
While I did enjoy ItB, I've never thought that it should be viewed before "The Gathering." For me, the movie is best viewed after the fourth-season episode "Atonement."

Of the movies, I think it's the most ambitious and epic; although, some of the meetings I do find a bit of stretch. Then again, it is a melodramatic and life does indeed contain coincidences.

Jade Jaguar February 23rd 08 21:09

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Galahad (Post 315777)
and don't forget he is face to face with the representative of the race that antagonized the Narns in the distant past. Passions are bound to run high.

Not so distant. G'Kar was a child when the Centauri occupied his planet and brutalized his people.

Galahad February 23rd 08 22:09

Re: EpDis: In The Beginning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jade Jaguar (Post 315859)
Not so distant. G'Kar was a child when the Centauri occupied his planet and brutalized his people.

I thought the occupation went back long before G'Kar's time and that it was merely his generation that threw out the Centauri.


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