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-   -   EpDis: Sleeping In Light (http://www.b5tv.com/showthread.php?t=9797)

vacantlook March 8th 07 01:36

EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Refresher Links:
Lurker's Guide Main Page for Sleeping In Light
Lurker's Guide Extended Synopsis for Sleeping In Light

vacantlook March 8th 07 01:38

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
This episode is thoroughly bittersweet and beautiful.

Jan March 8th 07 01:52

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
For this one there should be one other choice: Superlative. It never loses it's power over me.

Jan

KoshN March 8th 07 03:56

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
A++++

The best series (US def.) finale, ever.

GaribaldisHair March 8th 07 08:22

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
There should be a rule on these threads that if someone votes one of the acknowledged best episodes of the series as an 'F' they should at least have the stones to explain why they think that.

All in the interests of lively discussion you understand ... :p

KoshN March 8th 07 08:28

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GaribaldisHair (Post 290959)
There should be a rule on these threads that if someone votes one of the acknowledged best episodes of the series as an 'F' they should at least have the stones to explain why they think that.

All in the interests of lively discussion you understand ... :p

Agreed! How could anybody give SiL an F?

Galahad March 8th 07 08:36

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KoshN (Post 290962)
Agreed! How could anybody give SiL an F?

Oh I'm sure they could quite easily if they were just playing a joke and messing with our heads!:devil:

No it wasn't me!:angel:

GaribaldisHair March 8th 07 14:03

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I have to be honest and say that I did consider (for about 1 millisecond) giving it an "F", just to be contrary. And when I voted I saw that someone else had beaten me to it.

RW7427 March 8th 07 14:15

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Who could give that ep an F??? :eek:

KoshN March 8th 07 16:20

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RW7427 (Post 290990)
Who could give that ep an F??? :eek:

Some contrarian. An agent of chaos.

Mindwalker March 8th 07 16:32

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Me! because I was bored and was tired of seeing nobody vote "F" :p

crazyhorse March 8th 07 17:07

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KoshN (Post 291029)
Some contrarian. An agent of chaos.

See how these Vorlons try and undermine us?

Watch out for them,they are sneaky :p

:lol:

I'll vote a B.It's not in there with the best but it does close things off nicely.

It had to end somehow.

KoshN March 8th 07 21:43

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindwalker (Post 291031)
Me! because I was bored and was tired of seeing nobody vote "F" :p

That's no reason to vote an F. You vote what you think it actually deserves. Otherwise, you skew the results.


Quote:

Originally Posted by crazyhorse (Post 291039)
See how these Vorlons try and undermine us?

Watch out for them,they are sneaky :p

:lol:

Us? You and Mindwalker? But you gave it a B.

Yeah, I know, I shouldn't be the least bit serious about any of this.

Boxie March 9th 07 12:59

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
:D I'm with the guy who said there needs to be a higher rating than an "A"! What can you say about Sleeping in the Light, oh my gosh....

It always amazes me, it always makes me cry... How can something I've seen that many times still make me cry?? :D That's how good it is!

RW7427 March 9th 07 16:21

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I don't cry when I watch it any more, but it still gives me goosebumps. :lol:

Babylon5fan07 April 12th 07 10:06

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Ahead of Deep Space Nine's Series Finale and even Voyager..let's hope that the new Battlestar Galactica can have the same success as B5 with it's Series Finale.

Easily one of the greatest bittersweet bookend to one of the greatest shows ever on television. You can't help getting teary eyed and/or crying when seeing both Sheridan and B5 pass away. The fact that it's the only episode that is directed by JMS and that it's the only episode not to have beginning credits and music.

I'm getting emotional right now just rating this one. Wow! What an episode! Just the music alone makes this a very very bittersweet episode...I just wish Crusade could come back...I know B5 had 5 seasons and is complete but I still miss it very very much...

Alex

Sindatur April 12th 07 13:23

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Hi Alex, welcome to the site. I'm in Sacramento, as well.

Babylon5fan07 April 13th 07 05:26

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sindatur (Post 294337)
Hi Alex, welcome to the site. I'm in Sacramento, as well.

Hey there fellow Sacramento neighbor. Is there a B5 fan club that people can join? My wife was thinking of creating a V fan club which would include B5 of course..who knows..anyways thoughts anyone?

Sindatur April 13th 07 14:18

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Babylon5fan07 (Post 294416)
Hey there fellow Sacramento neighbor. Is there a B5 fan club that people can join? My wife was thinking of creating a V fan club which would include B5 of course..who knows..anyways thoughts anyone?

I'm not aware of one. Where at in South Sac? I live a few blocks away from Fox40

Babylon5fan07 April 14th 07 05:28

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sindatur (Post 294436)
I'm not aware of one. Where at in South Sac? I live a few blocks away from Fox40

Hey there Sindatur:

Just letting you know that I live off of Hwy 99 at the Mack Road exit..do you know where the intersection of Gerber and Power Inn. I live in that area..if not it's close to Florin Road..only about 6 minutes away from 80 and 50. Even if that's too far away from you a fan club we could centralize around downtown or something like that.

Alex

Sindatur April 16th 07 14:25

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I know where Mack and Power Inn are, not sure about Gerber, though. Seems you are very close.

Babylon5fan07 April 16th 07 14:31

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
My wife told me if I'm correct that channel 40 is somewhere off of Fruitridge? Gerber is only 5 minutes or so away driving distance wise. (When you go east on Mack Road going over the freeway keep going past Stockton Blvd. Instead of going left on Stockton where your going to CHP keep going down to Power Inn turn left all the way down to Gerber Road there is an Ampm and McDonalds in the same parking lot)

Sindatur April 16th 07 15:23

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Babylon5fan07 (Post 294760)
My wife told me if I'm correct that channel 40 is somewhere off of Fruitridge? Gerber is only 5 minutes or so away driving distance wise. (When you go east on Mack Road going over the freeway keep going past Stockton Blvd. Instead of going left on Stockton where your going to CHP keep going down to Power Inn turn left all the way down to Gerber Road there is an Ampm and McDonalds in the same parking lot)

Yea, FOX 40 is right on Fruitridge, in between Stockon and 99. I go to Stockton and mack often to a friends house.

Elipsis July 18th 08 04:02

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
And with this, I have rated every one of the episodes.


A+.


I was thinking just an A, but to my surprise... I actually found myself crying here even though I knew what was in the episode.

It's my first time with having watched the episodes properly in sequence... an adventure that took my girlfriend, and two of my friends 1 1/2 year watching a few a week together.

And while I am sad that there is no more B5 left to watch.... The episode reminded me more so than any other that the story of Babylon 5 is fucking beautiful, and as my favorite series sharing it with my girlfriend for the first time has been a somewhat emotional experience for some stupid reason.

I can't give it anything less than an A+ after the emotional state it put me in. She, of course, was fine while I was teary eyed and hanging off of her. :lol:

My friends were also fairly unmoved... but these are people who think the end of Evangelion is the most riveting thing they've ever seen... so go figure.

G'Kar February 5th 09 00:52

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
It's rare for me to even come close to crying during a television series (Yes I can be a very cold hearted person), but when watching this episode it really touched me in a way very few shows have (except maybe "Sunday" of Stargate Atlantis). For that alone this episode deserves an A+.

Sindatur February 5th 09 03:55

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by G'Kar (Post 335751)
It's rare for me to even come close to crying during a television series (Yes I can be a very cold hearted person), but when watching this episode it really touched me in a way very few shows have (except maybe "Sunday" of Stargate Atlantis). For that alone this episode deserves an A+.

Definitely. I can't recall a more perfect Series Finale, perhaps some that were close, and 10 years later some may be able to argue how it could've been more perfect, but, I'm thinking it's pretty much unrivaled as Series Finales go

Oh, and BTW, welcome to the site, if you like to debate, check the News and Politics sub-forum once you absorb all the treasures in the B5 specific ones. If you like to role play, cyber party, babble, etc, check the Salad Bar and Chat area.

G'Kar February 5th 09 21:06

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sindatur (Post 335754)
Oh, and BTW, welcome to the site, if you like to debate, check the News and Politics sub-forum once you absorb all the treasures in the B5 specific ones. If you like to role play, cyber party, babble, etc, check the Salad Bar and Chat area.

Oh I'm sure I'll get there eventually.

I actually just watched this episode a few weeks ago with the commentary from JMS and I must say you can really see that he put his heart and soul into this after listening to it [the commentary].

Estelyn February 9th 11 16:07

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
"Sleeping in Light" had me weeping most of the way through it - it is so very sad, beautifully so. I tried to pinpoint what made it so special (I very rarely cry for movies, even less for TV); the story is wonderful, the music evocative, but in the end it comes down to the actors, especially Bruce and Mira. Their ability to portray the characters' emotions is extraordinary; every look, every gesture is absolutely believable.

Now for some details:

Voiceover at the beginning - Garibaldi; at the end - Ivanova. I wonder why that choice; JMS didn't comment on it. For the closing words, I would guess that she was chosen because the events of this story changed the direction of her life and gave her hope.

I did a double-take when Sheridan walked into the picture - I wouldn't have expected him to be wearing Ranger clothing. But as was said later, he took on a greater role for the Anla'Shok since Delenn took over the presidential role for the Alliance.

My heart starts to break when Delenn tries to hold on to the hope that it may not yet be the appointed time and he replies that it is. She may think that she's prepared, knowing about this all those years, but when it comes down to actually letting him go, it's much harder than she realized.

Seeing the reactions of each of Sheridan's friends when they get the invitation breaks me up a little more. They know what to expect, yet they are devastated that the time has come. I like Garibaldi's statement that they often disagreed, but in the end, he's "a good man". That was Delenn's statement in the "Deconstruction"!

It's actually strange that Garibaldi is the one character who now has the most "normal" life! Wife and daughter, serious work, even wealth. The cigars are a great metaphor.

Yes, JMS knows exactly how different the typical male and female ways of handling such a situation are. Despite her own needs to talk about it more, Delenn lets him choose his own method. And the laughing and joking at the table is so very male! I'm amused to see Vir's hair as high now as Londo's was. And how typical his story about the Pak'ma'ra is for Londo - from something funny, a very touching tale emerges.

I do enjoy seeing Ivanova again! And when the toast is spoken, and she says Marcus' name, we can see where her underlying sadness comes from. She and Delenn withdraw for a female moment when the men are still talking - a very typical situation in any mixed gathering.

Sheridan's wish for a happy Sunday as his last day is so poignant. Interesting that he dons his B5 uniform for his final flight - apparently he still identifies strongly with the station as a vessel for his life's work. When he and Delenn say their final "good night", there's no stopping my tears. I choke up just remembering the scene now! So sad, so beautiful.

This scene reminds me very much of Arwen and Aragorn's farewell in the Lord of the Rings (Appendix A). It too is bittersweet, and though she pleaded with him to stay a bit longer, he knew it was time to depart.

Sheridan's last journey really has something Western-like to it - the lone cowboy riding off into the sunset. And the light metaphor shows up several times.

The last visit to the station is also bittersweet - we've seen it as the center of so many stories that it's hard to imagine it almost empty. How nice that at least one familiar face - Zack - shows up. G'Kar's statement that the voices would remain comes true here.

To have the station and Sheridan's existance linked is a poignant idea - reminds me of that old song about the grandfather clock that "stopped short, never to go again, when the old man died".

How appropriate that it's JMS who turns off the lights! Nice cameo - the only one, iirc.

"This journey is ended; another begins." I wish - as we all do - that we could have had another such journey. But maybe the good things can't be repeated (another Tolkien motive, for example the Two Trees and the Silmarils).

Despite the sdaness, it all ends with hope - there can always be new beginnings.


It doesn't get better than this.

Jan February 9th 11 19:47

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Estelyn (Post 367738)
It doesn't get better than this.

Amen.

I imagine I've also posted this upthread but the two places in this episode that have me sobbing are John & Delenn's farewell scene and the station destruction.

I hope someday to experience a show as good again.

Jan

hypatia February 10th 11 01:03

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I love a good "crier" movie. And this really was the perfect episode for that, and for nostalgia.

But my favorite episode over time, by far, has to be "War Without End". Everyone has that truly magical "oh.... OH, so THAT is what's up" moment. Interestingly, they are often at different points in the episode.

But that is a moment I will always treasure. A detail that was always there, floating under the surface, that made absolutely perfect sense in every possible way.

I guess a moment of realization is bigger to me these days than a moment of pathos. But there are a lot of great criers out there. There are not a lot of movies with a really great "Eureka" moment. :cool:

JoeD80 February 10th 11 01:34

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Estelyn (Post 367738)
Voiceover at the beginning - Garibaldi; at the end - Ivanova. I wonder why that choice; JMS didn't comment on it.

In the script, Ivanova has both the opening and closing voiceovers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estelyn (Post 367738)
For the closing words, I would guess that she was chosen because the events of this story changed the direction of her life and gave her hope.

It was also to connect back to the vision Sheridan had in season two, when we see Ivanova dressed for a funeral, according to Joe in his comments on "All Alone in the Night" in the script book.

Estelyn February 10th 11 06:57

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Ah, I hadn't thought of that connection! Thanks for the info, Joe.

deaded June 29th 11 09:43

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I just watched it for the ninth time and I STILL don't like it. In fact I really didn't like "Objects in Motion," "Objects at Rest," OR, "Sleeping in Light.". Nothing happened except for Lenier betraying the Rangers. The rest was just silly goodbyes. One goodbye show is OK. Three is ridiculous (not even counting 'Deconstruction' which was the best IMHO.

vacantlook July 1st 11 15:10

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I don't think I've ever seen anyone who disliked this episode.

Alioth July 2nd 11 05:34

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by deaded (Post 371591)
I just watched it for the ninth time and I STILL don't like it. In fact I really didn't like "Objects in Motion," "Objects at Rest," OR, "Sleeping in Light.". Nothing happened except for Lenier betraying the Rangers. The rest was just silly goodbyes. One goodbye show is OK. Three is ridiculous (not even counting 'Deconstruction' which was the best IMHO.

Well, "Objects at Rest" included Londo bearing that certain "gift" to the Sheridans' soon-to-be-born son... which figures significantly in the Centauri Trilogy, and (though unseen) the events we see in Sheridan's flash-forward in "War Without End".

But series-ending "goodbye" shows are almost always a bummer, and not things I look forward to with series that I've come to love.

deaded July 2nd 11 20:44

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vacantlook (Post 371626)
I don't think I've ever seen anyone who disliked this episode.

I can send you a picture if you want.

KoshN July 2nd 11 22:40

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by deaded (Post 371662)
Quote:

Originally Posted by vacantlook (Post 371626)
I don't think I've ever seen anyone who disliked this episode.

I can send you a picture if you want.

Vacantlook is not alone: I, too, have never seen (or known or met) anyone who has disliked Sleeping in Light.

Jade Jaguar July 3rd 11 22:42

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
Sleeping in Light will never be my most-watched ep, because it is sad and painful. But, it is also beautiful, and wonderful. I think most B5 fans consider it to be one of the best final eps of any series, ever. I know I do. I certainly prefer it to Deconstruction of Falling Stars, which was decent for something thrown together at the last minute, and without a prepared context in the B5 story, but none the less inferior to most B5 eps. That's my opinion, and others are equally entitled to theirs.

Lennier's Tears May 11th 15 01:45

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
I'm with Jade Jaguar on this ... I can't just casually watch this, I have to be ready for it. It's both the best and the saddest series finale of any TV show I've ever seen. I have never not cried while watching this. In fact, I could cry just thinking about it. That means it's excellent TV.

That's all I've got just now ...

Satai September 10th 15 04:31

Re: EpDis: Sleeping In Light
 
This is my post from FB of the finale which I just watched tonight. I also included a blurb on the similarities I saw between it and the BSG finale.

Wow...just beautiful I literally cried the entire episode which I haven't done that since the Battlestar Galactica finale. Watching the sun come up, having to discuss with the love of your life that you are going to die- heartbreaking. Seeing how all the characters turned out, looks like ole' Vir made it to Six! Ivanova nice to see her again (i know this was filmed during Sn 4) and ready to kick ass when that Ranger showed up. Garibaldi and Franklin still friends, even Garibaldi wanted to say goodbye. Dinner where they mentioned all those who passed on, sad to see even Lennier didn't make it. Mentions of Marcus, liked how Ivanova wanted to say his name. She is now Entil'zha interesting, she wouldn't take any crap that's for sure. Delenn/Sheridan that goodbye, her dressing up because it's Sunday. Sheridan going on his Sunday drive.... frown emoticon Loved that he returned to B5 and like Zack said he was still there, especially when they turned out the lights. I don't agree that they should have blown it up, but wow seeing it go as all the ships flew away. Looks like everyone did OK in the end, saw Zack working for Vir which was nice. Delenn waiting for sunup everyday... frown emoticon
Some suggested I compare it to the Battlestar Galactica finale. I did see two similarities: both ships were destroyed. BSG being flown into the sun, It guess that B5 got the better send off. Although the Galactica had the major battle before hand and then found Earth. Other similiarity: Delenn/Sheridan and Adama/Roslin. Adama on the hilltop by Roslin grave, was similar to Delenn sitting up waiting for sunrise. Although while Roslin's death scene was beautiful while being a tearjerker. She died before saying anything to Adama would have been nice to have seen a similar exchange to what Delenn/Sheridan did. (Heartbreaking to see him talk, as she is passing away and then have him look over at her) But both were beautiful TV Couples. Overall I feel this was more of a tearjerker then the BSG finale. Although I do cry at the end of the BSG one.
One hell of a ride and i'm glad I took it.

Renee


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