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-   -   EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father (http://www.b5tv.com/showthread.php?t=9543)

Bab5nutz June 27th 11 21:46

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father

Originally Posted by KoshN (Post 281550)

Originally Posted by Galahad (Post 281544)
It's pretty clear there are at least a few "good" high rankers in the Corps. Harriman Gray seems like a decent egg and he works in military investigations - presumably requiring more rank and P rating than a commercial.

Harriman Gray was a P10.

Harriman Gray, if I remember correctly was slightly different from most of the other Psi-Corps telepath. He had been born a "normal", had been "normal" during childhood, and well into his teens. In addition, he lived a life outside the Corps, among "Mundanes". He had wanted to be a combat pilot, and had been accepted into Earthforce when his talents manifested. As telepaths weren't allowed in Earthforce, he was booted out, and joined Psi-Corps as the law mandated.

Having lived among "Normals" most of his life, perhaps he didn't have quite the same contempt for them that a telepath who had been in the Corps from birth would have. And while he dedicated to the Corps, he wasn't blindly dedicated to it - at one point, he seems to suspect that Ivanova is a telepath, but he keeps mum about it.

I do have some slightly irrelevant questions about telepaths. Could a non-telepathic child be born to two telepathic parents? And what would happen to that child? Would it be expelled from the Corps? Or would they keep it around to see if it manifested ability later on down the track? And could the telepathic gene skip a generation. Is it recessive? And what would be the odds of a telepath and non-telepath having a child that was a telepath be? 50/50? 50/25? And if a telepath decided that they didn't want to either join the Corps, take the sleepers, or go on the run, but decided to try and pass as a "normal" like Ivanova, how strong would their abilities have to be before people started getting suspicous? Such a person would have to obviously have great self-disipline and control over themselves, and be on their guard at all times. They would have to think very carefully before having children - in case a child of theirs inherited their ability, and unwittingly betrayed them.

A_M_Swallow June 29th 11 10:03

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father

Originally Posted by Alioth (Post 371530)
Didn't psi cops have "bloodhounds" working with them in their posses, who were IIRC lower-rated telepaths who assisted in the chases (particularly the more dangerous ones) and provided added psi power for creating illusions/deceptions in the minds of their targets, as needed? Plus of course more physical manpower. Were they technically psi-cops of lower psi rating, just never lead detectives (which were probably all P-12s)?

Yes. Lyta (P5) was training to become one until she met Bester then she changed career.

Alioth September 8th 11 01:13

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father

Originally Posted by hypatia (Post 281542)
Another creepy aspect of that: the guy definitely moves after he's spaced. So however long he lived, you know he felt it. Somehow, that's even creepier than just shooting him in the head, to me.

Spoiler for The Shadow Within:
Supposedly Morden's wife and daughter, when their ship was destroyed in hyperspace, were stranded "out of time" at the moment before death--i.e., their sensation of that moment was one of an eternity--or so the Shadows told him (they could have been lying of course, to get their hooks in him). I wonder if that's what happened to that guy.

The Psi Corps certainly have no compunctions about permanently "hellish" non-death punishments, as witness what happened to that serial killer of teeps ending up in an insane asylum with unremovable horrible hallucinations and nightmares which Lyta tells about in another episode.

Lennier's Tears May 5th 15 22:23

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father
Look at this beautiful six page thread! :)

I enjoyed the change of perspective this episode offered, as well as the chance to look inside the Psi Cops training center ... Although, as Elipsis remarked upthread, this episode does turn into your average, run-of-the-mill, "we must hunt down a rogue telepath on Babylon 5" episode ... And that Psi Cops training facility is surprisingly mundane-looking! I thought the signs on the wall were a bit silly, especially the ones that just say "Obey". I would have expected the Psi Corps to be a bit more subtle in their indoctrination methods.

I agree with Bab5nutz that telepaths who were discovered later in life are probably not as on board with hating the mundanes as some others. The Psi Corps is all about replacing family, but I would imagine that people who lived with their mundane families for a long time still have a great deal of love for those people. It'd be a lot harder to get them into the us-vs-them mindset. We learn in this episode that Bester has been with the Corps pretty much since birth, which could explain some things.

Also like Bab5nutz, I have many questions about just how the telepath genes work, but I suppose that if that background stuff was never written down or worked out in detail, we can only ever speculate.

The way that young woman hits on Bester creeps me the hell out. It makes sense for him to have fangirls among the young trainees, and I like that that's in there, but it's just uncomfortable to watch. Clearly she's firmly in the "ehh, mundanes, whatever" camp, and so eager to please that she spaces a mundane like it's nothing. Also creepy.

We never really learn anything about low-rated telepaths inside Psi Corps. Both inside the Corps and among rogues we see telepaths sticking together. I kinda wonder if there's a lot of discontent among the Psi Corps telepaths with low ratings. They presumably have very limited job opportunities and they're stuck at the bottom of this strict hierarchy. They're probably not experimented on as much as some of the higher rated telepaths, but they're presumably also considered more expendable. They're practically mundanes, after all. I could imagine some resentment growing, under those conditions.

hypatia May 7th 15 03:21

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father
Telepaths being influenced by something as "mundane' as boring signs on the wall never occurred to me. But constant exposure to such things have been known to be used by many administrations. Whether it works or not, I have no idea.

What I always noticed about the Bester flirtation was the fact that he seemed so bored with it. Like it happens rather frequently.

Yes. That is creepy. And wonderfully written. :cool:

Mororless May 7th 15 08:19

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father
The impression I got was that most of the lower level telepaths didn't work directly for the Corps and weren't let in on its more sinister motives.

Whilst I would imagine working purely as a telepath would have been difficult for someone on the kind of level Ivanova was at there do seem obvious advantages that might give that better career prospects than a "normal". The ability to block casual scans and tell if your being scanned would obviously have value in positions were you might be privy to sensitive info and rogue/alien telepaths might be after it.

The latter also seems like a good way for the Corps to extend its influence by having a lot of members who they could draw on for such info without letting it be known they were.

Lennier's Tears May 7th 15 13:23

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father
Can telepaths get "normal" jobs? I guess I always assumed they couldn't.

Mororless May 7th 15 19:24

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father

Originally Posted by Lennier's Tears (Post 451536)
Can telepaths get "normal" jobs? I guess I always assumed they couldn't.

Maybe a kind of subcontract system like a commercial telepath but with the more limited abilities more of an "extra" in a job where they can depend on other skills? for example someone dealing with admin having training there but also the ability to block a scan to prevent info getting out.

hypatia May 8th 15 05:48

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father
My recollection of all the B5 details is not great, but I think this was kind of a question left open, wasn't it? Perhaps low level Telepaths can live and work in fairly "normal" jobs, if they are scanned regularly to be sure they aren't getting good enough to violate people's privacy? I don't recall the series actually mentioning what occupation they'd have.

Surely they weren't just shoved into a room and fed? (Or not fed?)

Lennier's Tears May 8th 15 16:14

Re: EpDis: The Corps Is Mother, The Corps Is Father
Haha :D No, I wasn't imagining them shoved into a room somewhere. I figured they'd have telepath jobs, just ... not any of the more desirable or interesting ones, whatever those may be.

I wasn't imagining telepaths in "regular" jobs ... Possibly because we never see it on the show. Also because many mundanes really dislike telepaths. As discussed earlier in this thread, Harriman Gray had to give up his EarthForce career when his telepathic abilities manifested fairly late in life, because EartForce doesn't allow telepaths to join. If EarthForce can refuse a whole class of people, presumably there aren't any anti-discrimination laws that prevent other organizations or companies from doing so.

I always assumed that an extra burden of being a human telepath in the B5 universe was that you had to give up any personal interests or ambitions and be resigned to a life of telepath work. But I could very easily be wrong! Who maintains and designs the Psi Corps facilities? Do they have their own engineers and janitorial staff, or do they contract with mundanes? Do they have telepath medical doctors and biologists researching telepathy? That sort of seems like something they wouldn't leave up to mundanes. On the other hand, there's probably not enough of them to make up a whole "telepath university".

Do we know what the approximate population of Earth (and its colonies) is at the time of the show? And the percentage of telepaths?

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